Swinger vs Polyamory vs FWB: What's the Real Difference?

0:07 All right, y'all. Before we dive in, a quick heads-up This show is raw, real, and definitely not rated PG We're talking about adult themes, sexual content, and the kinda stuff you probably don't want blasting through your speakers at work or around your kids So grab some headphones, pour your drink of choice, and get comfy Oh, and just so we're clear, we are not licensed therapists, counselors, or sex couches. Sex coaches. Sex coaches. Not sex couches We're just a couple of people sharing our lives, experiences, and sexy adventures in ethical non-monogamy. So with that, pull up a chair and enjoy the show Hello, and welcome to another episode of Beyond Monogamy.

0:53 I'm Adam. And I'm Pris. And today, we decided it'd be a good idea to talk about, uh… Well, you know, I went to a friend of mine, and he, uh, he's a barber. Yeah. And he got me all taken care of, and we were talking 'cause, uh, he's scoped out the show and he's listened to content. Mm-hmm. And what I realized is, is that he had no idea the differences between swinging and poly. Mm-hmm. And I just kinda wanted to talk about that, uh, from our perspective, kind of where we led through this because, uh, we started as newbie swingers. I mean, you had, you had experience before me.

1:35 I did. But would you say it was, like, good experience? Or, like, not, like, good or bad, but, like, were you knowledgeable of what this even was that you were doing? I did. Really? Like, you guys knew it was a swinging thing? Yes. No kidding. Yeah. I did. Huh. I knew exactly what it was. Wow. Yeah. And I was very intrigued. Really? Oh, for sure. Huh. Um, I wasn't jealous. With your… W- with the- No … the last guy? Mm-mm. No? Not territorial at all. No. Wow. No. Mm-mm. That's interesting. No. Ooh, I will tell you something. What?

2:15 I did not feel attractive. Okay. So I didn't know my worth. Fair. Okay? Sure. So, um, looking back now- We would always go for people who are, who were unattractive Who were unattractive because we felt like we couldn't go for anything better, huh? Yes. Yeah? Yes. Hmm. And me now- Yeah … can look back and say, "Wow, I could have really, um, one, been taken care of like a princess." Period. Yeah. Um, and how I didn't take advantage of that. And why didn't you?

2:56 Because I didn't know my worth. Gotcha. That makes sense. I did not know my worth, and when these men, looking back now, I'm like, "Damn." So let, well, let me ask you this because throughout the years, you, when you told me stories from your past before me- Mm-hmm … and, uh, people that you messed with and, and things like that, obviously I picture this incredible thing. I picture these hot people. It's all fantasy in my head. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Um, but the reality of it when we talk in a non-sexual setting was you didn't really find the people that you messed with attractive back then.

3:36 No. Mm-mm. No kidding. Mm-mm. Like, they just weren't attractive. You just did it for the experiences. Yes. That's interesting. Yeah. I think we all do that in the beginning, though. Yeah. Uh, but especially if you're not happy in your relationship or in the- For sure … sexual relationship too. I mean- Yeah, yeah, yeah. And, um, and you gotta understand that I am coming from- Being with somebody for 13 years, the same partner- Yeah who was really only my third partner- Mm-hmm … ever. Yeah. And then having experiences with women then behind his back- Mm-hmm … and really enjoying that, and then not explaining that to him.

4:23 Yeah. So when I got with my second, pretty much the second person, I didn't have any experience. No kidding. Like, if I could see those videos, because we did record- Yeah um, when recording was, you know- … a little- Yeah, yeah … like that's, I feel like years ago. The early, early digital recording. So what, Like '04? Oof. Yeah. Damn. Yeah. Yeah, it's like, uh- So I was not experienced. Um- Yeah … but I was super intrigued. Huh. I liked it. I liked the threesome. I liked the two women and a man. Really? So he would always end up knocking out. Passing out from alcohol?

5:03 Passing out from alcohol. Yeah. And I was always the sober one. Uh-huh. You know, I would have a drink, but I would not be intoxicated. Uh-huh. Um, I knew better because I am, I have always been non-trusting of men period. Mm-mm, that's fair. Um, and so I was always vigilant. But I did like that. I enjoyed him knocking out and me enjoying another woman and a man. So kind of, I mean- I would have my experience- Yeah … with the woman. Yeah. And sometimes the man didn't even work. I didn't get fucked.

5:44 So that, that right there, I mean, is kind of like an unethical hot wife experience right there. Oh, for sure. Like he was present- Mm-hmm … but not present. Exactly. It was not really consented. It was better when he was asleep. Yeah? Oh, yeah. You know, you had mentioned once before that the idea of the cheating is kind of a turn-on. Oh, God, it's such a turn-on. Yeah? But I think that's me and trauma. Mm. Understanding the cheating when I got cheated on. Ah, okay. Yeah. Okay. So I was like, "Oh, okay. That makes sense." Yeah. Kind of heat of the moment in the- Yeah … in some passionate- Yes … kind of shit. Just let's fuck, let's get this done.

6:25 Yes. Yeah. Yeah. Now, do you carry that kind of energy on into your experiences now? I don't. Why not? I don't know. Huh. Because I like you. Well, I like you, too. But you can't like me and, and still have that kind of energy? Um… Still kind of have that, that playtime, uh, switch. I can No Yeah? Yeah. You're kinda getting there? Yeah. Takes some time. I am for sure getting there. It takes some time for sure. I'm fulfilling my fantasies. Yeah. Not yours I think that's cool. Yeah. That, and that was kinda my thing was, you know, for years you did stuff for me, and I was like, "Dude, you need to fulfill your fantasies." Yeah.

7:06 And I'm kinda curious what your fantasies are. Well, that's why I learned that I'm a switch. Yeah. So, that's where the switch comes in. I'm so submissive to you, and not dominant, so I have to switch that off because I'm always submissive to you. So when you tell me, "Go and do something," you don't do it… You do it in a very soft way. Yeah. And I've told you, "Hey, if you pick out somebody here at the club-" Mm-hmm and you tell me, 'Go and fuck 'em. Go and try to fuck 'em," I would be like, "Yes, sir." That's fucking hot. But only to you. Right. Somebody else try to tell me to go do something, um, no. No. I'm not the girl for you. You're about to get smacked. Yeah. Yeah, no. Yeah. Um- I could be a sub for certain people.

7:48 Really? Mm-hmm. You could? I can, yeah. Outside of me? Yes. No kidding. Yeah, yeah. But now, and, and now you're kinda toying with that dominant side of you- Yes … with other men. Yes. How's that going? I like it. Yeah? I do. It actually turns you on, huh? Fuck yeah. That's something new. Yes. Yeah. And I like it because I'm getting assistance from you. Yeah. I can't really from AI. Right. Um, and just from, like, them themselves. Yeah. You know? Yeah. The sub is telling me, " You know, if you do this," and then I'm like, "Okay, hold on. Let me think about… I don't even know." Like, I wanna do this because it's hot.

8:29 I don't know how. Now, when did you realize that this was an actual turn-on to you? I don't know Hmm I don't know ' Cause all of a sudden it was just like, "I like this." I think I've always had it- Yeah … but I've always pushed it down for you. How funny. I know. Wow. Yeah. Mm-hmm. That's interesting. Mm-hmm That is interesting I think it's so hot Yeah. You know, I, uh, I gotta tell you, you know, I, I, I don't mind the aggressiveness. Um- But you gotta be warned … I do gotta be warned ahead of time. Uh-huh. Like you, uh, you told me today. Yes. What did you ask me? I said, "Do you want dom Pris or sub Pris?"

9:11 And what did I tell you? And you said, "Maybe…" You said you liked s- you want it kind of in the middle. Yeah. No pain. I'm not really a pain giver. Yeah. I don't like the pain. I like a firm softness. Yeah. Um, so like I want you to be aggressively wanting me- Yes … but at the same time not, uh- Yes … not hurting my feelings. Yeah. ' Cause I have sensitive feelings. Yes. Yeah. Very sensitive. So I, I… So yeah, I do that. Now, I have a question. Yeah. I don't even know what this topic is of this show. Oh, we're getting there. But, you know. What, um, what, what do you like in other women?

9:51 What do I like in other women? Do you like subs? Okay. Uh, you know- I know the answer … I am, uh, apparently, if there was supposed to be a label on it, I'm a pleasure dom. I don't know. I don't really care for that title, but, um, I like to please people- Mm-hmm in whatever way that means. Mm-hmm. So I've had women tell me straight up, "Well, uh, I'd like to be dominated in the bedroom." Uh-huh. "Like, I'd like it if you gave it to me rough. I'd like…" Mm-hmm. And that's not normally in my nature. Yeah. Like, if I'm doing it for, for my pleasure, that's not gonna get me off. Mm-hmm. But if I know that doing that's getting this person off- Mm-hmm … then it will get me off. Mm-hmm. You know what I mean?

10:32 Um, so I think my… I don't know. I, I feel like my, uh, ideal situation is almost like a 50/50 thing. It's like right down the middle. It's a little bit of, uh, give and take- Mm-hmm … in the session- Mm-hmm of hot aggressiveness, but also giving, uh, some submission there, you know- Mm-hmm … and that sort of thing. Just kinda going back and forth. Mm-hmm. Kinda like a delicate ballet, you know? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I dig that. I think you lean more toward the submissive. Probably. Mm-hmm. Probably. Uh, I do like an aggressive woman. Mm-hmm. Um- Now, do they have to warn you?

11:12 Or is it just me? Uh, that's just you. Okay. It's just you because I am conditioned- ' Cause you like me more … ' cause I'm, well, 'cause I'm conditioned- … on how it's been for so long. Yeah. And it's such a difficult transition to just pull the rug out and go, "Yeah, I'm not doing that anymore." Yeah. And it's like, ah. No Yeah … you know. I've really enjoyed, uh, how we've conducted ourselves previous to this Yeah And, and so I like exploring stuff with you, but at the same time, I don't want anything to really change 'cause I've really enjoyed it What… I wonder what would happen if I just totally wanted to just be dom? 100% with me? 100% with you. Like, I would tell you, like, "That's it." Do you think you would go I mean, and not go I mean, that's- But you, I think, I think, I don't think you'd be happy with that I don't think you'd ever do that.

12:01 Well, and, and, and what I mean by that is you love me too much to give me- I do. I do to give me that. Yeah. You would never just say, "This is me now, and I'm not working with you on anything else." Some people do. Like, you would never do that. Some people do. Um- Some people, like, have no… Like, and what if… Like, there's some people just have no choice sometimes. Well, it's the same thing with- Yeah with the whole polyamory thing, you know? Yes. For those who don't know- Mm-hmm … we were poly for about five years. Yeah. Um, and, uh, it was my idea, jumping into it. Uh, we, we did it. We didn't know much about it, and we made some mistakes. Uh, but in that situation, it's, it's kind of that whole deal where it's like, well, I mean, we gotta, we gotta try it- Yeah and see if we even dig this sorta thing.

12:45 Yeah. Um- I think that's where a lot of swingers- Mm-hmm … start. I think- I mean, I, I feel like if you… I don't- Well, so I think a lot of swingers are confused about poly. And what I'm starting to realize this, the more people that I talk with- Mm-hmm … um, a lot of people either identify with the swinger side or the poly side, or they say, "Oh, well, I'm both." Mm-hmm. And there's really no other discussions about dynamics of those, of those dynamics. Right. And what I found is there's a lot of people who claim they are poly or claim they want to be poly. Mm-hmm. And really, they're not looking for a romantic relationship.

13:27 They're just looking for a connection of some sort. Doesn't necessarily have to be romantic. Mm. For those who don't know, polyamory means that you're basically involved with many people- Yeah … and, and share love- Yeah … romantic love with each other. There's a lot of that going on there. Um- It's a relationship … it's a relationship. That you're having multiple relationships. Yeah, yeah. Mm-hmm. Um, and so, or, or, or many loves essentially- Mm-hmm … is what it breaks down to. Uh, so when it comes down to that, I mean, you kinda have to… Y- you have to, one, you have to be really solid, but then if you're gonna go tell your spouse, "Look, this is me now," Yeah "and you can't have it any other way. Either you're gonna do this with me, or you're gonna see the door," Yeah … well, you have to really feel strongly about that- Yeah … in order to just tell your partner, "Hey, it's all or nothing, baby."

14:19 Yeah. Um, you would never do that to me. I think it's also… I wouldn't, but I think it's also, um, but there are people that have told their spouse that they're no longer- Yeah, yeah swingers and they're only poly. Yeah. Um, we know a lot of people who are going, are navigating through that. Yes, we do. Um- We do. I, in my head, when, um, when we were swingers at, in the beginning- Yeah … and then we decided to try poly I still kind of put myself in the swinger mindset- Yeah, s- … to accept it Well, so that's the thing about it is, I don't think we realized exactly what- No the romantic portion of poly was.

15:03 We did not understand this. We did not get the whole idea that this is a whole-ass relationship. Mm-hmm. Like, I saw the words on the page, but it just didn't register, you know what I mean? Yeah. Like, the whole time, the very first kind of, um, I guess relationship you could say that we pursued was we had a good friend of mine that I knew for a long time. Mm-hmm. And, um, you became really good friends with her. Mm-hmm. And the three of us started hanging out, and unfortunately, it was a wounded bird situation 'cause she was vanilla, but she was going through marital problems. Mm-hmm. And so she was, uh, kind of becoming a single mom in the process.

15:46 And you know, the three of us all had chemistry for what it seemed. We got along. We had chemistry friend-wise. Yes. It was amazing. Now, It was. When the three- Like- … of us were together, it was amazing time It was really fun, yeah. Um, and she knew that we were, uh, starting this whole poly thing. Mm-hmm. And we were all talking about it. And, and she was like, "What is it? What exactly is it?" And we're like, "Well, you know, you could, you could date a couple." Like, we were- Mm-hmm … we were really trying to shine up this- Mm-hmm … turd here- Mm-hmm … uh, for us, uh, to make it look like, " Hey, you know, this, this might be fun for all of us." And I remember it was, like, a Christmas night- Yeah that we were out, the three of us. You know what we need?

16:27 What? A little button that has, like, a little red flag every time we have, like, red flags because we did s- we were such red flaggers. So many red flags, totally. When we were swingers in the beginning- Red flags … we, we were red flaggers. Totally, yeah. Like, ugh. And then poly, oh, my gosh- We were, oh, my God … so many red flags. Um, we were the, uh, we were the people that we would tell you not to go- Stay away … around. Yeah. Uh, because it was kinda predatory. I mean, it's that typical couple looking for the unicorn type of situation. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. She was bisexual. You were bisexual. Mm-hmm. Um, and I was digging you both. Mm-hmm. And so I was like, "Why can't she be our girlfriend?" Yeah. Um- And we did end up meeting people who were poly.

17:09 Yes. And I say that loosely. Yeah. Um, but that particular relationship, uh, it crumbled not only the romantic portion of it, but also crumbled the, uh, friendship. For sure. Uh, because she didn't know what she was getting into, and we didn't know what we were- No … getting into. Mm-mm. And I think that, in and of itself, is reason enough to listen to others. Yes. Listen to others and their experiences. Get their, get- Tread lightly … get as much advice as you can get from anywhere, anybody. Yeah. If you accept, if you ta- if you use it, great. If not, it's gonna be in there.

17:51 Yeah. It's gonna be in- Now, I will say, and I can tell you this right now, my idea of polyamory was very muddled, and- Mm-hmm … I notice that there's a lot of swingers who have the same issue of muddling when it comes to polyamory, because they think they want that. Mm-hmm. And what they really want is more of a friends with benefits situation. Correct. I did not realize just how much that's what I wanted- Mm-hmm … uh, over polyamory- For sure … uh, till we started exploring this whole thing. For sure. Mm-hmm. Because now I'm going, "Shit, I don't want a- Yeah … romantic relationship. I don't want the obligation of having to s- text with somebody every single day, and have to call them on the phone, and make sure they're doing okay, and play that typical role of boyfriend.

18:36 That is exhausting. I already have a good marriage. I'm good, thanks." Yeah. Uh, what I do want is to be able to connect with somebody as a friend, joke around, laugh, be that flirty friend. You know, do that whole thing. Yeah. Uh, you know, a- and, and still have, uh, affection towards each other, but it's still a friendship. Mm-hmm. And it can follow up with some, uh- Mm-hmm … some freaky fun time. You know what I mean? Now, for that, to be very honest with you guys, I was still very hesitant about. Oh, yeah. I was- That was a rough one … not comfortable with it. No. I did not- ' Cause Polly, Polly really caused you a lot of trauma. Yeah. And so, um, it took a lot for me to Allow him to do that and persuasion on his part.

19:24 Oh, it was not- In the beginning- It was rough … it was a, it was hard. For both of us. It was very hard. Um- We got into arguments- Yeah … disagreements. Yeah. Um- We had to hash out a lot of stuff. And sometimes it was under my skin. He had to really dig it out. Yeah. Um, and he had to accept certain things. So you, if you want it to work, you communicate. Yeah, absolutely. Like, I think all of those experiences really brought us to where we are at now, and this show has brought me to where I am now. Which is pretty cool- For sure … to be able to say that- Mm-hmm … uh, a lot of your personal growth is- Mm-hmm … attributed to the show.

20:05 I'm sure that we have listeners out there- Yeah … who their personal growth is also attributed to the show, and that's pretty damn cool. Yeah. Uh, we're not experts, and I say this all the time. I tell people, "We're not experts." The reason why we know what you should avoid is because a lot of times we were what you should avoid. Yeah. We had different experiences, and we didn't have that mentality of we were gonna be these people- Mm-hmm … um, intentionally. Mm-hmm. We just didn't know. Yeah. We didn't know any better. Yeah. And if you don't know any better, that doesn't make it any better, but at least it's not intentional. Mm-hmm. You know? Yeah. Um, I would… What would you say, and this, I, I'm just kind of curious.

20:49 This is just conversational, but what would you say probably the, the worst in poly was for you? Like, the, the absolute worst point where you were like, "Fuck this. I'm done. I can't do this no more"? Um The tipping scale. Because I know you didn't like it the whole time, and I got that, but it obviously got worse and worse and worse and worse and worse. I just didn't like sharing you like that. Yeah? Yeah. Yeah. You know, I, I remember- That was the hardest … it was very romanticized in my eyes. Yes. First off, I worked very hard to get a girlfriend. Like, it, it, I worked very… Like, I was on these, these apps, and I was constantly swiping left and right, and I was searching for this, and I was having these conversations and that would lead to nowhere.

21:38 And so when I f- it was almost like fishing. I attribute it to, to fishing. Mm-hmm. And you're throwing your line out there, and you're throwing your line out there, and then finally you get a bite and you get excited. Mm-hmm. And it's like, "Holy shit, this is somebody who's interested in me. Holy shit, this is somebody who's willing to, to go down this journey and, and be my girlfriend, uh, in this s- you know, in this poly journey with me," you know, that sort of thing. So I get all excited. Uh, and then of course there's, there's that whole new relationship energy thing. Yes. So I'm throwing all my attention into this person, and it's like I'm constantly on my phone, which I know would annoy you and, and that sort of thing. Oh, man.

22:18 I would go through his phone. Yeah. I was very sneaky leaky. Um, and- Uh, those were, those were some crazy times … those were some crazy times. Yeah. Like, I am not a quiet woman. Like- Well, so- I did not know how to communicate, and I would communicate with just bitter, icy colds … I thought at some point maybe you'd come around. Mm-hmm. Uh, but I remember the last girlfriend that I had, um, it was hot and heavy at the very beginning because it was a sex thing. Mm-hmm. Right? Uh, so we had, like, our first or first date, and then our second date ended up at her place. Mm-hmm. And we had sex. Yeah. Um, and then from there it was like, oh, we're in this relationship.

23:02 She's my girlfriend. Okay, whatever. Yeah. So then I remember it wasn't too far into that relationship, I was at work- Mm-hmm and I was going to the bathroom, and my phone was just going off. Just buzz, buzz, buzz. And I'm like, "Fuck, dude, I'm exhausted. I'm stressed." I was working for a handyman, uh, agency- Yeah. Yeah … and I was just very annoyed and stressed. Mm-hmm. Money was tight. Uh, I was doing an office management job that was just not a good job. Um, and I was just like, "Dude, leave me the fuck alone." Like, I didn't say that, but I was feeling that. I was like, "Dude, I…" Like, "I don't wanna talk to you right now.

23:42 I'm not interested in being the attentive boyfriend right now. I have shit I'm dealing with." Yeah. You know? Um, and so I remember that's kind of where I started getting annoyed with the idea of the whole relationship thing. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Uh, and then as time went on, she was just so eager to fucking talk to me, and it was constantly, "When am I gonna see you again? When are we gonna make another date? When am I gonna see you again? You know, you're my boyfriend, so I gotta see you, you know? Oh, you know, it's my birthday. Are you gonna come out and see me?" Blah, blah, blah. And it's like, "Fuck, dude." Like, I'm exhausted. It's been a long day. My solace and happiness is with my family. Mm-hmm. And you're trying to take me away from that. And I remember feeling like there was this obligatory, um, just- complete feeling- Yeah … of, "I have to do this."

24:28 Yeah. And so- I was dating you were dating- I was dating a woman … but it was never anything like that. No. I think she was obsessed with me. Oh, yeah, that's right. Yeah, yeah. How, w- w- how did that even start? I met her s- 3Fun, something. Was it on the app? You met her on 3Fun? I I think so. Interesting. Yeah. I don't remember, honestly. And what was wrong in that situation? I wasn't comfortable. You weren't comfortable? No. What do you mean? She just spoiled me. She wanted, she bought me- Oh, yeah … so many things. You know, that was really the first time that I ever- Mm-hmm … felt a jealous feeling towards- Yeah … a situation. Mm-hmm. Because she got you, uh, your first AirPods.

25:10 Mm-hmm. And at that time, AirPods were very expensive, and I was trying to figure out how I was gonna scrape the money together to try and get you some. Mm-hmm. And you just mentioned it in conversation, and this person just bought them for you, and I was like, "Oh." Mm. She saw them in a picture. She saw them in a picture? Yeah. And it was my second time meeting her, and she wanted to take me to lunch, and I was like, "Okay." I remember she was always talking about wanting to take you on vacations. Oh, yeah. And that And she bought me so many things. Yeah. So when, when that broke up, I don't know. What did she do with that shit? Maybe returned it, but whatever. I don't know. But I, I just remember the conversations, like, we had that conversation of, "Oh, well, she wants to… She's trying to woo me to take me on a vacation," and this and that, and I was like… I remember sitting back and going, "Well, I mean, I think I'd be okay with that.

25:57 I mean, if you wanna try it, go ahead and go." And that's when you looked at me and you're like, "Fuck that. Like, I'm not going on vacation with nobody." No. And then you looked at me and you said, "We don't go on vacation with people." We do not. And I was like, "Oh, okay. Well, that's fine. I mean, that's not a deal breaker for me." And we don't shower with people. And we don't shower with people. Mm-mm. Yeah, there's things that, uh, I guess we hold sacred. Unless we're doing content. That's different. That's different. Yeah. But, uh- Business … you know, the poly thing, I- I was talking about this the other day to you that- Mm-hmm … I realize now, and I realize that a lot of others realize this too- Mm-hmm is that, like I said, I didn't want the poly thing.

26:38 Uh, and I realized that after that last relationship that I had, and I had to break it off- For sure … um, because it was just too much stress for me and I couldn't handle it. And now I'm like, "Why am I gonna try and fix a relationship when my relationship is just fine?" Mm-hmm. You know, this one's my priority. Mm-hmm. What I wanted was a friends with benefits. Mm-hmm. I just wanted somebody to hang out with and be flirty with- and be able to have sex with. That just seems- no strings attached, let's just be friends- let's be buddies, and hey, let's lay the pipe every now and then. And it, but it took me a long time to realize that. Yeah, yeah. Like, I remember you talking about it. And so we didn't even, after poly, we just, we were just chilling. We kinda connected. Yeah. Um, and then we… I had to heal a little bit, but I didn't know I had to heal.

27:22 Yeah. You know, you, you did have to- We didn't communicate. No. Yeah. There was a lot of… And you know what's funny is, there was a lot of conversations that we had over the span of that first year- Mm-hmm … year and a half- Mm-hmm … after we stopped being poly, and they would come out in little spurts. Oh, yeah. Every time we were in the car. And mine was very passive-aggressive. Every time we were in the car, you would bring up something and you'd be like, "You know, I remember when this was happening in poly, and I just, I couldn't stand it," and this and that. And we would talk it out. Mm-hmm. And a lot of the stuff we worked out- Mm-hmm … over that span. Oh, yeah. Um, and then when I decided, I said, "Okay, you know, I, I really would like to connect with other people and have a friends with benefits situation," and I remember telling you that.

28:07 And you said, "Okay, well, that's fine." And I said, "Well, okay, but you're fine with me going out on, like, dates. "… with these people, right?" Yeah. And that's when you c- you sat by and you said, "Why do you have to go out on dates with them?" Yeah, yeah. And I remember this was a whole conversation that we had. "Why do you have to go out on dates with them if it's just a friends with benefits situation? You're doing this for the sex, right?" And I'm like, "Yeah, I'm doing this for the sex. But I'm also, I want a friend." And it's like, well, why do you have to go out on a date with them? And it's like, well, because as a guy- Mm-hmm most times- Mm-hmm … I have to work on that connection, and a lot of women need to feel safe. Mm-hmm. And women don't feel safe unless they're in front of you and they can feel the vibes and they can see that you're a safe person, that sort of thing.

28:52 Correct. Like, it, it, it takes a lot of work from a guy's standpoint. I don't know if it's necessarily the same from a woman's standpoint, is it? Um- Or even women with other women … and I still disagree with that, what you said. Yeah? Yeah, like, it doesn't. If you're a swinger, if you're in the lifestyle- And I understand not being transactional, but you don't have to go on dates. A date, like let's go meet each other, you know, whatever. Okay. Uh-huh. Cool. Because, I mean, honestly, how many times do you see your friends and you're not fucking them? Um… it starts with a date. Well, I mean, our friends we see often, and we don't fuck them That's a friends thing We don't see friends.

29:34 We see them at the… Like, we fuck for the most part We have a lot of friends that we fuck- Mm-hmm … but we hang out with them as friends and don't fuck them several times over Those aren't dates, though I mean, they can… I- So here's the thing- My thing is like we don't have to woo … is I think you associate the word date- With romance with romance. Yes. Oh, yeah. That's right … that's not- That's right … that's not what a- But we agreed to disagree on that That… Well, you agreed that we agreed- See, that is … to disagree on that That is something- I didn't agree on that at all … but, but, but to go back, that is something that Y- I, you and I kind of agree. Like, you're cool with me being that way. Like, you understand. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

30:15 You understand what I mean. Absolutely. Like, I get where you're coming from. Yeah. I don't agree with it- Yeah … but I will, uh, I'll go along with it, sure. Yeah. Because I love you. And so far, it is what it is. It is what it is. Yeah. Yeah. I, um, I think that a person can go out on a date- Mm-hmm … with friends- Mm-hmm … and it not be romantic, even if it were to end in sex. Yeah. It would not be romantic. Um, and I think that's… The, the word date, just the same as the word polyamory, really gives a bad rap in your book. Uh, but it's just a date. Yes, it does. It's just a date. And, but there's no convincing me yet, and I'm still am- I'm- What… And so instead of the word date- Nope … what is another word we can use?

31:02 Nothing. There's not another word? I'm gonna- Rendezvous? No. Rendezvous. Just don't do it. Rendezvous sounds even dirtier, actually. I mean, unless she wants to take- Rendezvous sounds romantic me somewhere or she's like, "Hey, I just… I'm gonna order a pizza. Cool if we eat before we fuck?" Okay, cool. Text me, because that means I have to give you some time to eat because you only have a two-hour… That's a- You have a two-hour rule … that's a date, girl. That's a date. Okay. But fine, don't tell me that. But we can use a different word and it doesn't have to be- Well, let me come up with a word like that. What, what's another word that we can use? So it's not rendezvous. We can't use rendezvous. Oh, you know what? What are you gonna do? Well, you know, back in the day- Uh-huh … uh- You are so freaking hot.

31:46 Thank you. Mm. Uh, back in the day, I used to have a thesaurus dictionary. You're such a nerd. And you just got hotter, Boo Boo. Well, let me tell you why I had a thesaurus dictionary. Why, my love? Because I wanted to be a rapper. Uh-huh. That's right. So I, I, I loved words. Okay. And I loved finding rhyming words. And so- Finding rhyming words. Uh, that's right. Say that five times fast. Um- I… Well, do… Can you rap? No. Have- Not at all. Have you tried? Uh, no, no. Can you skedaddle? Can I what? Skedaddle. So it's not skedaddle. I think you mean scat. Yes. Yeah. No, I can't. Oh. Yeah. Huh. I, I, like, I tried.

32:27 Mm-hmm. I've heard jazz musicians do the scatting. Oh, I know. And like Mel- Yeah, yeah, yeah … Mel Tormé and, and- Yeah, yeah … you know. Yeah. And I just think it's so cool, but I think when I do it, I sound so lame. Hmm. I know. I doubt it. Oh, it's true. It doesn't work for me. Nothing of you is lame. Okay, here we go. Okay, we're not gonna call it dates. Uh, oh, okay. Maybe, hold on. It's asking for, uh, specifics. Okay. Okay, here we go. So we agree rendezvous sounds a little romantic. We don't wanna do that. Mm-hmm. Tryst. Ugh. Nope. Yeah, no, that doesn't have a good sound. No. Get-together. Maybe. Our genitals will have a get-together.

33:08 Nope. Mm-mm. No? Okay. Nope. Okay. Nope. Outing. An outing. Nope. No. Me and Ellen are gonna have an outing. Who the fuck is Ellen? I don't know. Ellen DeGeneres? Um, a meetup Okay … so I'm gonna go to this meetup across town Okay Yeah Yeah I could do that. You could do meet up? I could do meet up. And when you go, it's M-E-A-T. Ha, that's right. I am a joker. I'm a smoker, I'm a midnight toker. There's another one here that says evening out. I don't- No … that's weird. I don't like that. And night out. Mm. Liaison. Nope. That implies secrecy and romance, though. That's no good.

33:48 Uh, assignation. I put the ass in assignation. Formal itinerary often implies secrecy. Well, fuck you, assignation. We're not doing it. We're doing meet up. Meet up. Mm-hmm. That's right. Hell yeah. Okay, I like that. I like that. I like that too. All right. Um- See, that's communication- Yeah … people. That's working out your shit. Yeah. Uh, so there we go. Something to work on there. No using the word date, no. Mm. Bad. Nope. Not good. Uh, but, um- And always bring leftovers … always bring leftovers. Oh, that is, that's our rule when we go out- Mm-hmm uh, to eat without each other. I like dessert, he likes savory. I do. I'm a, I'm a savory person. Mm-hmm. I'm not a big sweets guy.

34:29 Mm-hmm. Uh, so now we stopped being poly. We took that little bit of time off. We got back into swinging. Yes. Um- And that's where the friends with benefits- And that's where we started interjecting the friends with benefits. Mm-hmm. Okay, real quick before we get back into it, we gotta talk about sdc.com Oh, yes. Okay, so if you don't know SDC, it's basically the largest online community for open-minded adults Which if you're listening to this show right now, I feel like you probably already know if that's your scene. Yeah. It's your people all in one place. Just make a profile and go explore No weirdness, no judgment, just a ton of like-minded humans living their lives, just like us.

35:13 Honestly, it's kinda fun just to poke around Yeah, it really is. Go sign up at sdc.com. Use code 38236. Links in the show notes. Okay, now back to what we were saying. Yes Now, the entire time until probably most recently, you've been pretty, I don't know, against the idea of it- Yes … of friends with benefits. Yes. For both of us. Si. Uh, but now you've, uh, you've come along. I have. What switched you over? What changed your, your feelings on that? Um, I've met some really cool people. Yeah? Yeah. And you've discussed even the possibilities of having romantic relationships?

35:58 Um- Is this- … with couples. With couples, yeah. Yeah. And, and it has to be, like, it's with, you know, the unicorn. You know, I don't think- We have to get along and- Yeah … you know. Yeah. Her and I don't have to necessarily, like… No. I want somebody who's bi and we're into each other. I would, you know, if we dated, like, if we'd legitimately dated another woman- Mm-hmm … the both of us- Mm-hmm … um, I'd wanna do it right, obviously. You know, we did it wrong the first time around. We didn't know what the hell we were doing, but now we know what we're doing. Mm-hmm. I'd wanna do it the right way. I'd wanna find somebody who is completely into both of us- Yeah … without, you know, more this way, more that way.

36:43 Yeah. But also, you know, somebody that understands- There's a little bit of hierarchy. Yeah. And I've had people in the poly community get very upset- Yes … that we would even say that. Yeah. But that's our- And understand … that's us … that's our agreement. And if anybody wanted to join us, they would be joining us under that agreement. Mm-hmm. Yeah. And as long as they're okay with that. Mm-hmm. Uh, you know, but obviously people go, "Well, that's unethical." Well, it's unethical- And you know- if you're pushing it onto somebody, but if they agree to it. Yeah. And you know- Right … I was thinking about that. That's right now. Like, that's right now. That's right now, yeah.

37:24 You know? Once we're empty nesters and it's just us, it may be a different situation. Yeah. You know? Well, you never know. It might be a deeper relationship. Yeah, yeah. Um, right now we devote our time to our family, you know? This is true. It- We're still raising children … it's hard to break away during the week- Yeah … and sometimes on certain weekends because we're still raising kids. Yeah. And- And we like to really be with each other, like- With each other, yeah we're each other's best friends. So going out on separate dates, or excuse me, meetups with others. Ooh. Ooh, sorry. Give me your hand. Yeah, sorry. My bad. Yeah. Uh, on separate meetups with others while, say, I'm at home or you're at home.

38:10 Yeah. That's always a hard one for me, and I'm sure it's a hard one for you, too, because we don't like to be apart from each other. No. We don't. We always enjoy being around each other. Yeah. We people watch together. We, uh, you know, point out things and this sort of stuff. That's what we do. You're my best friend. I'm your best friend, so it works. Yeah. Um, so it's difficult to say, "Okay, well, I'll be back later," and then- Mm-hmm … come back a few hours later and be like, "Okay, I'm turning back on the switch for you now," and that sort of thing. Like, it's weird. Mm-hmm. It's weird. Yeah. Um, I'd rather do it with you. Yeah. And I would be down to date another couple, and I think that's the ideal situation is dating another couple because I'm not bi.

38:51 Yeah. Um, and I'm not obviously going to be having sex with the man of the other couple. Yeah. Um, but I mean, dude, you can have a bromance relationship. Yes. You know? You can be best friends with the guy- Yeah … while the women date each other. Mm-hmm. And I also date, uh, a woman, and he dates a w- you know what I mean? Like- Yeah … it can happen. Yeah. But then you can hear the whole thing where, oh, that's the real unicorn is finding that- Yeah … other couple that everybody's connected. I mean, of course, because I'm, I'm a little harder to… Please? Please. Choosier. Choosier. Yeah. Yeah. Now- Choosy moms choose Jif. That's right. Um, we were talking about meetups, right?

39:33 We were. He's pretty fast. Like, you're cool with just- Getting down to it? … getting down to it, because you have- I've gotten there now, yeah … yeah, y- you know, um- I've realized I don't have to work as hard- There you go … as I need to. You're welcome. Yeah. You're welcome. Yeah, that is something that I've taken away from you. Yeah, yeah. That you've said is… You know, I, for what I'm looking for- Yeah … I don't have to work as hard. Yeah. If I want an even more solid connection, if I was looking for something romantic, then yeah, obviously I'd, I'd have to work harder. Mm-hmm. Um, but I really don't have to work that hard. No. Yeah. No. Um, I have noticed that some of the guys that I talk to are actually the only… Well, one of the guys that I actually went to a meetup with- … um, is a little slower than my husband.

40:28 Yeah. Yeah. You know, how… I actually wanna… That's a good thing to talk about there, because your experiences with men throughout the years- Mm-hmm uh, it's very rare that you've had good experiences- Mm-hmm … with men. Um, they're either too fast or not fast enough. Mm-hmm. And this one is kind of, I think, at a good pace. Yeah? Yeah. Um, and it's… We were talking about that on one of our shows- Mm … like, how many meetups, right? And I was thinking about that, and I was like, well- I pretty much am… I'll do, like, regular hookups- Yeah … at the club. Yeah. You know, with friends. Um, but, like, meetups, I think I want that to be a little slow.

41:13 Really? Yeah. ' Cause you want trust there. Yeah. You wanna feel comfortable and safe. Because I'm so… Especially with men. I don't think it would be the same with women. And yes, bias. Now, what do you mean? So how would it be different with women? Be faster? Faster. Yeah? Yeah. I think- Mm. Sexually faster. Yeah, I think sexually faster. Um- Interesting … because it's so hard to find… For me, it's so hard to find women that I connect with- Ah, uh-huh … and that actually want to hook up. Yeah. That's interesting. I know. That is true. It's so- Yeah … freaking hard. Um- Because I'm, I don't like the bi-situational. Like, I under- uh, like, I use it in a very negative way.

41:54 Yeah. It's been told to me so many different versions of it. Yeah. But I'm not a bi-situational. I like experienced women who like women. Right. Like, I find that super hot. Now I'm also, like our bestie- Mm … has never been with a woman. Right. I'm ready to crack that sh- shell. Um, because I know the connection's gonna be there. Yeah. You know? I- Yeah … I think it's gonna be fun all around. Right. So. Yeah. Well, you know, and that's really the, where you can give that perspective because- Mm-hmm you're, you're bisexual. Mm-hmm. And so what you do with women and what you do with men can be completely different. It is, yeah. Yeah. Um, and obviously it's kind of funny, y- you are that woman that I used to have to work hard for.

42:41 Yeah. And back then when I was working hard for it, you'd be like, "You don't need to work that hard." No. And you… They don't need to work hard. Yeah. Like, they really don't. I like these men, so. But they have to establish safety- But- … and trust … but for them, they're a little slower. Ah. And I'm cool with that. Yeah. I'm like, "All right. If you wanna get to know me better, then that's fine," because I feel men really put a lot of pressure on themselves. Yeah. And, um- I can see that … you want to be… You don't wanna be grosero, you don't wanna be rude, right? Right. You don't wanna be, um, controlling. No machismo-ness. Well, so you wanna be- A gentleman … you wanna be a gentleman.

43:25 You also want them to know… So there's a fine line there. You want them to know that you're interested in them, but you also don't wanna be disrespectful. Yes. So you don't wanna be too forward, but you also don't wanna be too backward- Yeah … and, and not showing interest. Because you may catch me, you may send me… You may catch me on a bad day. Your first impression is important. Yeah. I can see that. Mm-hmm. And there's been some people that have been fast. And I don't have a type, but I kinda do have a type. What is your type? I like any race Ah I like bald Mm. I like my height or a little taller Uh-huh Um, that's on men. Yeah You know? I love beards.

44:05 Well, before you get into women, I wanna stop you there. Okay. Because everything you listed, I'm checking boxes, obviously. Oh, you wanna go out with me? You wanna meet up? Uh, I think I've already put the work in. But here, here's what my thing is. Uh-huh. And we were having this discussion the other day. Mm-hmm. What I look for in this lifestyle- Mm-hmm … is not you. I have you. Yeah. So I don't look for you in all the experiences I have. I look for different body types. I look for different personalities- Yeah and that sort of thing. And if we were poly and we were dating- Mm-hmm … I would not look for somebody like you. Mm-hmm. I would look for a different body type, a different personality type.

44:47 Mm-hmm. Now, I, 'cause I have you. Yes. But you are attracted to me. Because we are attracted to different things. I'm 50/50- Uh-huh on physical- Yeah … and what's the other one? Mm, emotional? Physical attraction and- Personality … yeah. So, like- And the other 50 is personality? Yeah. So yeah, so it's, exactly. Yeah. Thank you. You're very welcome. Bing. I felt like that little cartoon with the little light bulb. That was cool. Um, so I'm 50/50. You lean more to the I lean more toward the personality personality Yeah Yeah … toward the personality Yeah Like, um- I can- That's your thing A personality can really- And- … make somebody attractive … the submissiveness They want you I, yeah, I can get down with that They want to, like, worship you.

45:40 Yeah. Well, you know, it all comes down to, and I, I've said this before and I'll say it again, it all comes down to my experiences in high school. Mm-hmm. Um, or, or lack thereof. Well, I think even, or even being the only child. Uh- The, the wants. Yeah. Well, you know, I was, pretty well ignored at home. Mm-hmm. Yeah. But I was always chasing love. Yeah. I was always chasing the girl. Yeah, yeah. Um, and I, you know, I think my longest relationship at that time was, like, three months. Yeah. Like, my relationships didn't last very long. Yeah. I was a chubby kid. Mm-hmm. I was not the jock. I was not the guy who was fucking top of my class. I, I really didn't have anything going for me.

46:22 The only thing I had going for me was that I was funny. Mm-hmm. Um, and people liked that, but I was also a gentleman with the ladies. Yeah. I was very much a gentleman. I thought you were- I was raised by women … I thought you were handsome. Well, thank you. Yeah. Like, I've told you. Um- I, I remember seeing you and I was like- I did… So I think all of us look at back, at ourselves in high school- Mm-hmm … and go, "Wow, I was not as bad as I felt I was back then." Yeah. Um, I felt like I was the complete outcast of the high school. Like, I have no idea why I was there. Same. And so because of that, you know, we grew up through the '90s where American Pie was a thing, and you see all of these- Mm-hmm … these kids, they get out of high school and they go and, a- and they have these parties, and everybody's hanging out, and it's sexual parties- Yeah … and all this stuff.

47:11 And I, I was a horny guy, man. Yeah. I was just as much trying to get poontang as every other high schooler was. What? Yeah. I was on the prowl, but the difference was I was not as aggressive with it as some of my other male counterparts at that time. And I wasn't a deceptive person, so I wasn't going to deceive somebody into trying to give it up either. Oh. Um, so because it wasn't willingly being thrown at me, I felt like a failure- Mm-hmm … when it came to being sexual- Mm-hmm … in high school and then again in college. Yeah. Um, you get this whole idea made out for you that college years, it's all sexual, and that's- Yeah … when people experiment.

47:58 They have all this fun and stuff, and so you have this build-up, this expectation. Mm-hmm. And then you go to college right after high school and nothing's doing, chief. I went to a couple parties where I maybe could have, possibly, but nobody really showed any interest in me, and so I was just- … kind of there. Um, but outside of that, the women in college actually wanted to learn- Yeah … and actually wanted to do homework. Yeah. So when somebody would contact me for a, a homework study date, they actually wanted to study. Yeah. And they weren't interested in me at all. So- Throughout my 20s after college, I was still the unsuccessful fat guy- Mm-hmm … who was a tagalong.

48:39 I was the guy who had the great voice that the ladies would swoon whenever I would sing. Yeah. But that's as far as it went. I was the guy who made people laugh, but then everybody went off and went to go literally go fuck- Mm-hmm … like in the open. Mm-hmm. Like, they weren't swingers. They were just fucking easy, and they would go and they would all fuck each other in this group, and I was always the friend that was left out just kinda there, you know? And, and I, and looking back on it- … I, I really should've been a higher point on that list in that group. But I'm just, I… That's just me looking back on it. There you go. Anyways, uh, well g- that's a confidence thing now. Looking back, I had no confidence, and maybe that was- Yeah … the, the thing. Yeah. Uh, but all of those experiences of feeling unsuccessful- through my high school years, through my college years, through my tw- my early 20s.

49:27 Mm-hmm. Always feeling unsuccessful sexually When I got to experience the lifestyle, I got to feel that all over again. Yes. I got to feel- Yes, and poly … uh, I got to feel that, that same high school feeling all over again. Yeah. And I'm chasing it, and I'm not catching up to what I want. Mm-hmm. Um, I'm just being kind of judged and ridiculed. Yeah. And either people, if they are interested, they're not saying so. They're not reaching out. And if, uh, you know, the ones that, uh, I'm interested in definitely don't want me. So, you know, it makes you feel worse about yourself, and then one day you realize you're thinking too much.

50:08 You just need to be yourself. You need to have confidence, and you need to go in with no expectations. And the moment I realized all of that and I started trying to build myself up confidently- Mm-hmm that's when I started getting wanted by women. Mm. That's when I started feeling women get a little bit more aggressive in their hunt for me, so to speak. And of course, because of that, I'm good, you know, with somebody kissing me without consent. You know, like, I'm good with certain things because this is the experience that I wanted then and never got. Mm-hmm. And now I'm here. Mm-hmm. I'm having my fun.

50:48 Mm. I'm having a great time. I'm connecting with all of these people, and that freedom of sexuality and being able to move, and being able to do it with you- Mm-hmm … and being able to move along throughout this entire journey is really fun. Yeah. Um, I remember watching MTV in the '90s, um, '96, '97, whatever. You know, Real World and all those different reality shows were on. And there was one where they were showing these… they were older than me, but probably, uh, early 20s, and these groups of friends, they all go out to the club. They all drink, and they're all f- kissing each other.

51:30 Mm-hmm. They're all making out with each other. The guys are making out with the girls. The girls are making out with the guys. The girls are making out with the other girls, and then there's three-way kisses going on. And I remember the first time I saw the three-way kiss, where two girls and a guy start making out in front. Mm-hmm. They're in a club. Mm-hmm I got so hard that my dick could have broken glass. I don't know what it was about the make-out session. It seemed very slutty- Mm-hmm … for one thing, which, bam, caught my attention. Mm-hmm. But then on top of all that, it's taking place in front of everybody. They don't give a fuck. It's actually being recorded. It's on fucking MTV. Like, how hot is that?

52:11 Mm-hmm. And I just remember thinking, "God, I wish I could have a group of slutty friends like that, that I could be a part of." Yeah, yeah. And now we're in a community of it- Yeah … which is great. Uh, but that whole- But that's what… I think that's what you used to chase. Yeah. And I'm not chasing it anymore … you don't chase it anymore. No. But I mean, that… because, you know, different person. Yeah, yeah. But I think that's where we started after poly. Yeah. And then now we're here, it's a little… it's different. But what we were saying is the person that I talk to is a little slower, and- Because that connection for him is different. Right. So it's like, who do you follow, right?

52:52 So, like, if you ever met a, a woman and she's like, "Mm, I go a little slower." Yeah. Like, you would have no choice, you know? Right. But that would be a communication between me and you. Yeah. You know? Yeah. You know- Something you and I have to talk about. I like where we're at now. I can't foresee myself getting romantically involved with anybody. As a matter of fact, I think you and I have done a, like a swap, because you're more open to it now. Mm-hmm. And I'm less open to it now. I'm, uh… You know, just the thought of having to entertain a relationship is cringe to me. Yeah. But I'm also… I've been in my most stressed state of mind- Yeah … um, since being laid off since last Au- Yeah … uh, August, you know.

53:39 Why would I want to entertain a, a relationship when I already have so much in my head as is- Yeah … right? Yeah. Um, you just never know the person that comes along. Mm-hmm. I know, uh, M- Myrina and Nick- Mm-hmm with The Accidental Swingers, um, they… as they said on, on our show, they just started as swingers. They didn't look to be poly. They didn't wanna be poly. Mm-hmm. They are in a poly relationship with another couple. Yeah. And I just saw that on their show, you know. Yeah. That, you know, it's, it's, it's… They said they didn't seek it out. It just kinda happened. Yeah. And I think that is cool, because it just happened.

54:22 It was organic. Yeah. You know, they didn't try to stop it. They just went with it, and it took place. And who knows? Maybe that will happen. You never know who we'll meet in the future, or who we've already met and the timing ends up being right, or whatever the situation is. Uh, but I like the fact that even if it never happens, you, uh, have opened up your mind to different experiences. Mm-hmm. And you're ready to just go for the ride. Yeah. ' Cause we're not getting any younger. Yeah. No. All I- Have a little fun. Have fun. All I know is I wanna make sure my relationship is always protected. Yes. And I'm a- … always protecting it. I am a needy bitch.

55:03 Oh, man. I am needy. Yeah. I'm s- So much … spoiled rotten. Uh, I'm not that type of guy who will go- No … "Hey, I'm gonna go have drinks with the guys after work." No. "I'll see you at, like, 8:00 or 9:00." No, we… I- if I'm gonna go- out after work, she's coming with me. Yeah. You know? Yeah. I'm very hormonal. Oh. Well, you know. I mean, I'm in menopause, so it is what it is. It is what it is. We navigate. We, we're navigating right now. A little rough, a little bump sometimes, but I think we're good. Oh, I love where our relationship is at. I think our relationship is pretty Pretty good. Yeah It is solid Yeah It's probably the most solid it's ever been. Yeah, for sure. Um, and I think that's cool.

55:44 I mean, I'm still working through stuff. Oh, yeah. You know? Yeah. And you're still having to- Navigate that … navigate, and we talk about it, and we help each other, and- Of course sometimes we agree to disagree, and- … it is what it is. Yeah. It is what it is. Yeah. That is true. Yeah, so, uh, that was a pretty good show. I like where that went. I, I think that this is something personally that we could probably talk about for another hour. We can. I'm not gonna do that, though. I hungry. Uh, yeah, we need to, we need to eat. We need to get ready. Yeah. Uh, because if you're listening to this, it's Sunday. Yesterday was my birthday, and chances are you're probably gonna wanna scope out our socials and listen to our quickie on Wednesday, 'cause we're gonna be talking all about it.

56:28 Mm-hmm. Um, but before we let you go, just wanted to let you know we've got our live streaming show running every Thursday night, 7:00 to 8:00 PM Central Time, right on our website. Remember, it's 100% free. So you just pull up a chair, chat with us, and other listeners in real time. Mm-hmm. It's a lot of fun. Hey, technology, you know? You get to see me. That's right. And my honey. That's right. And it's fun. It is fun. And speaking of the website, beyond-monogamy.com, is where you'll find everything. Full episodes, the blog, our merch that I make. Oh, yeah. And our 100% anonymous confessional. I think that's your favorite. That is my favorite. I love that thing. Yeah.

57:08 Well, you put a lot of work into that website. I did, and I like the fact that people actually use it. Yeah, so if you got something on your mind about the lifestyle, ENM, kink, the show, whatever it is, hit him up. Yeah. He likes it. It makes him very happy. It makes me feel useful. And it is completely anonymous, so don't even worry about it. But we will read it on the air if you approve. That's right. And don't forget, you can always catch us over on fullswapradio.com every Thursdays at 2:00 PM and 7:00 PM Central. Of course, why would you wanna go there at 7:00 PM Central when you can just go to our live at our website? That's right. And mark your calendar, 'cause we will be at Crazy Winter Nights in Kansas City on February 19th through the 21st of 2027.

57:51 You can use code BEYOMONO, that's B-E-Y-O-M-O-N-O, for your discount. That's right. I like how you broke that down. That was good. Thanks. Uh, yeah. And the, uh, website for that is gonna be in our show notes. All right. Uh, also shout out to Proteax Health for keeping us going, always keeping us healthy and keeping us in the know. Uh, always go to proteaxhealth.com and use code BEYOMONO, like you heard the lady earlier. That gets you 15% off if you wanna go check 'em out. So check 'em out. Uh, and with that, we thank you guys for joining us as always for another episode, and we will see you guys next week.

58:33 Bye.