Unfiltered but Not Unkind: Hard Truths About Swinger Etiquette & Communication

0:07 Alright y'all, before we dive in, a quick heads up. This show is raw, real, and definitely not rated pg. We're talking about adult themes, sexual content, and the kind of stuff you probably don't want blasting through your speakers at work or around your kits. So grab some headphones, pour your drink of choice and get comfy. Oh, and just so we're clear, we are not licensed therapists, counselors, or sex. Couches. Sex coaches. Sex coaches, not sex couches or just a couple of people sharing our lives, experiences and sexy adventures. An ethical non-monogamy.

0:47 So with that, pull up a chair and enjoy the show. And. Hello and welcome to another episode of Beyond Monogamy. I'm Adam and I'm press, and today we're doing something a little different. This episode is called Unfiltered, but not unkind. These are the opinions we have. The thoughts we share privately, but don't usually say into a mic. That's right. It's not a call out episode. There's no rage, there's no dunking, there's no rage. But you're gonna have this with me, right? This is me and you doing this. Well, no drama farming. That's right. No drama farming. What is that? You're supposed to read it like with confidence, like you know what that is?

1:28 Oh, no. Drama farming. No. You still gotta say it better than that. No drama farming. Yeah, right. Just thoughtful, honesty, humor, and some real conversations about the lifestyle. Cause we are being honest. Some things in the lifestyle need to be talked about. You look really good, baby. Thank you. Okay, so why are we doing this? You know, we've both had moments where we've left an event or a party or a conversation. We just said, I don't wanna sound judgy. Mm-hmm. Best friend ears. Oh my gosh, yes. This, that and the other. Mm-hmm. And it's normally something that, if you have to start the whole sentence with, I, I don't wanna sound judgy, you know, it's, it's a judgmental sounding thing.

2:11 I wanted to have a moment of honesty here, have, have some unfiltered babe. Uh, just throw it out there. You know, you're the very opinionated one. Another two of us, babe. But I think you know how to say things kindly okay. And I think it's, yeah. You know, everybody wants to know what your opinion is about stuff. They don't. I think they do. Okay. You know, talking about those moments doesn't make you negative. It makes you care about the space. So the lifestyle doesn't grow if everyone's afraid to say anything real. Uh, and, and a lot of times the stuff that we say is stuff that we say on the show. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. It's stuff that we said in person with other couples, and we've had people go, I know, right?

2:55 Yes. Uh, so yeah, I, I'd say let's go ahead and talk about some of the patterns that we've all noticed, but don't usually talk about. All right. Now I know what's coming. My wife does not. Uh, because that's the beauty of a DH ADHD is she's just gonna, I know what he said on his live is I just sit here. Yeah. You sit there and just sit here and you, and you and I be, and I, so there's cer there's certain things that sometimes you say and you don't realize that you said something that you're gonna get in trouble for get, and then it's like mentioned a day later, Hey, Classic Adam and Paris. It's total beyond monogamy. Alright.

3:36 Anyways, lifestyle behaviors. We quietly side eye. That's what we're talking about right now. Oh my gosh, honey. Yeah, there are, I'm never gonna get laid, you know, I'm not, that's, uh, I mean by men, I mean, if you're not gonna get laid, I mean by men, I won. That's by your choice won't but by women. I will. Because a lot of women will be on my side. Yeah. That's usually the case. The first one, the difference between confidence and lack of self-awareness. Now we've had discussions about this before. Because, you know, it's one thing to be confident. Yes. It's something completely different, uh, to just not be Yes.

4:17 Self-aware, so Of your situation. Yeah. Or whatever the case may be. Yeah. We were, I was just talking about this with a friend, but I feel like it's gonna be too mean, so we're gonna keep going. But see, that's the whole thing is you're supposed to try and say it in a kind way. Okay. So tell me, while being 100% open, anonymous, gimme an example of confidence and lack of self-awareness. Would this be it? I had a friend talk to me and she's pretty, she's hot, and she was like, Hey, so you get hit on a lot. And I'm like, I know. And she's like, but you get hit on a lot by unattractive men.

4:57 Why? And why? And I said, okay. Yeah. And she is like, like they have a lot of confidence. Do you think they know that they're not a, and so this is, this is a good example. And my friend is not in the lifestyle. My friend is just a friend. Um, she's mom, probably my only vanilla friend that I have. And we're scrolling through the Facebook group. Actually, no, we were scrolling through my Reddit page and my other page that I have, and people were like, and she's like, wow, these guys wanna take you out. And I'm like, yeah, they do. And she is like, okay, well, can I tell you something?

5:38 And I'm like, yeah. And she's like, does Adam know about these guys? Like, and I'm like, yeah. And she's like, doesn't he tell you that you're too pretty to go out with them? And I was like, no, my husband doesn't do that. I don't really see these guys well, and I'm gonna be honest, I don't I know what she's talking about because this has been brought up to me many times. Yeah, this has been brought up to me many times that. I don't care. Like I get a lot of people that, that message me and that wanna take me out and, you know, and whatever. A lot of men, and no, they're not all attractive. Mm-hmm. Um, but they're nice and I need something to be attracted to.

6:20 Right. So, yeah. Maybe they have, you know, nice teeth or whatever. Like, I'm not very, I'm not shallow. Mm-hmm. I can be sometimes, but I'm really not. Yeah, no, you've actually come out. Yeah. You've come a long way. And so would that be a difference of confidence and lack of self-awareness? That would, that would actually be exactly on the nail. Like, I just hit it. That's right. On it. Because, I mean, I know I'm not the only one who thinks this, and I'm, and I'm sure she is not the only person who thinks this because it's come across my table. It's come across me before I've, I've, people have told me this before and have talked to me about it. That's. That's crappy, but it is what it is. I mean, I, I mean, I don't think I'm the, the prettiest person around well, so that's the thing about it.

7:05 I, and I've heard this from several people before. We've talked to countless number of people that have brought it up Yeah. In, in, in person before. Yeah. And I've heard it said before where, they're, there are people who have said they're really confident. Yeah. And, and is that sexy and confidence is sexy. And I think that's where a lot of that comes from. Mm-hmm. That's, that's why there's a situation where people may, may not find them casually attractive. But. Confidence is sexy to a point. And then to point. Well, so over point. Did y did y'all hear the point emphasis on the two point?

7:47 Because over overconfidence, I mean, like anything, and like anything, every, everything can be overdone. Yeah. You know what I mean? Confidence is great. I think everybody should have confidence in themselves. Everybody should believe in themselves. I believe that too. Yes. Uh, to an extent. Yeah. Um, I, I don't think that, uh, we all should be walking around like, like we're a bunch of Cindy Crawfords and things like that. Yeah. You know, I mean, that's not we're normal people. Yeah. Uh, well normal. What is that? But we're just average people. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? We all are in this community. Yeah. There's several people who have bought their bodies. Yeah. Okay. Great. You guys look amazing.

8:27 Good for y'all. Um, and you should have confidence. Yeah. Because you look amazing. Yes. But. The rest of us who maybe are having our regular mom and dad bods. Yeah. We maybe struggle a little bit in that. So then we do our best to be confident. Confident. Mm-hmm. And so that right there, when you can find somebody who's confident in their own skin and that sort of stuff. Yeah, I get it. You know those people, they're like, you know what, I better better show up. That's her. Yeah. Because I was telling her, I was like, there's so many beautiful people. Like I love the lifestyle because of that. Yeah. Yeah. There's so many different women. There's sizes and so freaking confident.

9:08 I didn't find my confidence until. I don't know, a few years ago, honestly, really I was not confident. Now I am. I, I love my body. Could I, if I could buy my body, I would totally buy my body. I'll give you my cash app later, guys. Um, I also have a Venmo. So like, stuff like that, like I, I would, but yeah, I didn't find my confidence until, and I get more confidence. Yeah. Going to the clubs, really. I mean, I, I get naked sometimes. Yeah, you get full-on naked. I'm like, you do like, fuck it. I've got layers. You see me, people, you know what I look like. I'm not hiding anything. Like, there's some days where I kind of wanna leave my top on, you know, just because I'm feeling a little bloated or I don't know.

9:55 I wanna give my best show. Yeah. But other than that, I don't care. I, I'm so comfortable in my, I'm comfortable in my own skin. I have days, but. So I've, we've talked about you being hit on by by a lot of people. Yeah. And the majority of 'em you don't initially find attractive. No. Mm-hmm. Uh, especially on the, on the men's side. Correct. But there are some women also. One thing I did want to bring into were that you do get hit on by some pretty hot women. So, I mean, there's that I do, I do get hit on by with some pretty hot women. So while you may not be getting hit on by hot men Yeah.

10:37 Which, what, what is even a hot man to you? Like what, what do you find that's hot? I love What, what is it that that meets your criteria? Lemme tell you what I love, guys. I love a guy who's I love. Dad bods. Love Dad bods. Oh, thank you. I love him. Um, I love a well groomed man. So you're, if you're gonna have a beard, have it groomed, have it have nice, like take care of yourself presence mm-hmm. Is one of my top things. Oral hygiene, you know, have good teeth. I understand we can't all afford dentistry, but, hey. Or dental visits, but little brushy brushy. Little flossy. Yeah.

11:17 Yeah. Um, I like respectfulness, so if you're gonna talk to me. You don't have to touch me. Um, if you notice that I'm touching you, then there's an open door right there. Right. Because I'll like rub arms if I'm like into it or whatever. It's very rare. 'cause you've really never seen that. Very rare. Very rare. Very rare. Yeah. Like, I like that. And if, if I'm flirting with you and I've opened the door to the, the deeper flirting. That doesn't mean for you to send me a picture of your wiener. Don't do that. Don't do that. I don't, I don't, I don't think they're very pretty. So Yeah, don't do that. I wouldn't send you a picture of my vi jj.

11:58 I'm pretty sure everybody would be pleased with that. I mean, I've got little gray hairs there, guys. Just an FY like I am all natural. Does the, what is it? Does the curtain master rug? Yes. Yes it does. Just an fyi. I have a little triangle patch, but it does right Bebe? Yeah they're, uh, I think you have a little, do you have a little streak on the side? Oh. Oh, that's sexy. That's so, I mean, I want some, you know, anyway, that, that went off course, but yes. This is why we don't do this. But yeah, no, I want somebody who's nice. I saw this guy on Facebook and I reached out. Yeah. And we had just talked about this, you and I, and I was like, man, this guy's really cute.

12:41 I, I think I'm gonna shoot my shot. Yeah. And I did, but you can tell this guy is hypersexual, which is a turnoff for me. Is it? 'cause you're married to a hypersexual. Hypersexual is a turnoff and there's days where I'm just not having it. Boo. That's fair. You know, and there's days where I'm just not in the morning. I'm just like, poking me with your penis. Hey, it's nature baby. I know, baby. I love it. It's my wake up call. Yeah. You could tell he's gonna be very hyper-focused. And how I, under, how I figured this out was I sent picture or I said something and then it got sexual. Yeah. And my, my, my thing wasn't even like, let's go for it wasn't, yeah.

13:24 And I'll show it to you. I think you probably read it. And I was like, Hmm. So hypersexuality off the bat is a turnoff for me. Yeah. The lack of control. The lack of control. There you go. Yeah. I couldn't figure out why. Well, 'cause you know, you gotta know the right time and place to be able to bring it in. Yeah. So you don't want to bring it up too quick. Yeah. But you don't want to take forever either, because then somebody's gonna think that you don't have an interest. Yeah. So there are ways to do it. And wait, wait for some, like ask, I've had guys ask me, Hey, you sent me that picture. Do you mind if I send you a picture of myself? I'm like, yes. Only because you asked. Yeah.

14:04 Well, you know, respect really seems to turn you on. Yeah. That has always turned you on. Yeah. Yeah, don't do that. That's a little bit too much. There you go. There you go. That's a lot. So then the question is when. Somebody decides to shoot their shot if they're the right amount of confidence. Does it have to be completely physical for them to catch your attention? No. No. Not completely. But there's gotta be something. Gotta be something. It's gotta be, there has to be something. I've something. Your eyes, the way you're talking to me, there's a guy who we, there's a couple that we see at the club. Mm-hmm.

14:45 And the guy is, he slowly layers a flirt. Oh yeah. Like he, the way he talks, the way he talks to me and touches me and gives me a hug and stuff. It's very sweet. And never. This guy, this any kind of like, oh, I wanna be with you. I've never done that. But he's super nice, super nice that I would totally sleep with him. Yeah. Because of that. Yeah. Just because he is just super nice, like Yeah. Let's go to the back, sir. So it really doesn't take much. It doesn't, it doesn't. So a lot of these people that message you, what is it that's happening in these messages that's shutting them down right away?

15:30 The hyper sexuality. Yeah. Hyper sexualness. It really bums me out when they just launch right into stuff. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I've had guys that I slept with and they don't even come at me like that. No kidding. They're super respectful. There's a time and a place and feel my mood. And if you know me, you know, I'm not always in the mood like, yeah, wait till I put something out. And then you're like, okay, yeah. But yeah, it's, um, it is, it's that I don't really care for that. And you know, and it's an in-between age too. It's either the real young ones or the viejitos.

16:11 The older ones really like, it's never like, like this age. It's either or thirties, forties than us, fifties or older than us that are like hypersexual, like they're going through their teens again. Yeah. Which is fine if you're a woman. If you have a woman and you, and she likes it. Y'all are going through that at y'all's own pace, but really hypersexual, like they're going in through puberty again. Mm-hmm. So weird. Now I'm curious, what do you think about hierarchy in the community. Like, do you feel like there are levels of people in their attractiveness and like everybody kind of has their lane. I've heard somebody say this before. Hmm. Where somebody hit on them and she was relatively attractive and somebody hit on her and she was like, oh man, this person really needs to stay in their lane.

17:01 'cause that's just not, and without saying those words, you know, it's just, they were just kind of like, they just need to stay in their lane because why? Well, I mean, mean if I'm, if I'm reading the tea leaves Right. Uhhuh because he's not attractive enough to be on her level. Oh, I've had many people say that. Yeah. I've had people say that to me and I'm like, stop. That's not nice. Yeah. Yes. Yes. Wow. I think when we were poly, I said that. Really? I'm sure I said that to you. I'm sorry. Yeah, I probably did say that. You probably did. I, when we were at Poly, I am sure that I said, oh, this guy needs to stay in his lane. Yeah. Or this chick needs to stay in her lane. Yeah. I mean, come on. We are not everybody's cup of tea.

17:42 So that's why I don't hit on anybody. That's why I don't hit on anybody. And apparently that's why you don't get hit on very much, you said, I mean, I do. I get hit on, I just, I don't get hit on by the people I find attractive. Yeah. Period. I have to feel something true. You've got hit on by unattractive women. I have. I have at that. Yeah. Many times I have. You do, you booboo and I'll probably end up sleeping with that. That's you. Just because I don't know how to say no. You know what I also don't like is when people treat every interaction like a sexual audition.

18:23 Oh, absolutely. Uh, I know you get that a lot at the club. I've seen it so many times before where so they'll introduce this new couple to the club. Mm-hmm. They'll bring them up to us and then throughout the night, whoever it is, is just, just staring at you all night. And they'll come up to you and they'll be like, oh, hey, how's it going? And they'll puff their chest and they'll do all this stuff and they'll try and touch you and talk to you certain ways and things like that. Meanwhile, their wife is over at the table sitting there alone, sipping on a whiskey, wondering where her husband's at. That never took way too long in the bathroom. That never happened. It's happened that, that wasn't just imagined.

19:06 I'm just saying that wasn't just imagined. I didn't just come up with that off the cuff. That never happens. Ingrained in my brain, baby. Who? That never happens. Some couple. Some couple. It was this couple. Um, yeah, I know. And he was wearing like a shirt with a fish. I don't know. It was a thing. Yeah, they do. Some of them do. They tr they I don't know what to tell him. I don't know what to tell 'em. I normally don't tell him anything. I let you, you, I let your face do the talking. I'm just because eventually, somehow, eventually you end up kind of turning Yeah. A bit more and facing me or because I move around a lot. You do move around a lot. That's your A DHD, like you're constantly. Everywhere. Yeah.

19:46 Uh, and yeah, sometimes your dance moves have danced us out of situations. You're welcome. Yeah. Yeah. You're welcome. Now, I've never had a woman treat every interaction with me. Like a sexual Oh, yes, you have every woman. Oh, every woman. Maybe every woman. Not every woman. Oh, my God's a bit dramatic. Every woman. Let's go overboard with this. That makes out with you at the club. Well, no, those are, those are just kisses. Those are just kisses. Okay. Well, maybe those are just kisses. It depends on who it's coming from. Okay. I see where you're, I see where you're going. If, if it, if it lasts more than a second Yeah that's making out Okay.

20:29 You don't have to look at me like that. I'm just saying, goodness gracious. You get very spicy unnecessarily. It's just words on a paper. You're the one who made these questions. Well, goodness, you're spicy. Goodness. Well, I didn't think about that, but yeah, I guess you gotta, but you get it more than I do, do I? Mine is just pretty Well, you get it. I mean, you get it, you get it. You know, they give you that special handshake, that story that you just gave Nas, the chick leaving the guy there to come over here and make out with this. Well, now that's not true at all. And I bid you to strike that from your memory listeners. Okay? Because it's not true. Uh, now this is an interesting one. Oversharing explicit details in spaces that didn't consent to that energy.

21:14 I have had people meet me in person. Usually a husband or a single guy, whatever. Uh, at a party or a club, whatnot. Events meet and greets. I've had on countless occasions, guys who just decide to come up to me and show me their sexual conquests on their phone, different videos of them getting it on with this girl or that girl or whatever. And I'm hoping that whoever they're showing me consented to, that sort of thing, they probably didn't, but this is a thing. Like, it's just automatic. It's like, Hey guy, look at this. You know what I mean? I mean, I've had girls share pictures of, I, I'm not, I like porn, you know?

21:57 I like to see stuff like that. But I. I don't want, that's oversharing. I don't even, I don't fucking know you, man. Like, why are you sharing that with me? Because they want you to share, or, or, you know, when they message you and all of a sudden they message you and it's like, Hey, how's it going? And I'm like, good, how you doing? And then all of a sudden, bam. There's a video of of, of him and and his wife getting it on. Yeah. And he is like, that's me and my wife. What do you think? And I'm like hey, good for you man. Good to go. Good job. Hope you got some water after that. And then they'd be like, uh, so am I gonna see anything? And I'm like, what the fuck? Fuck. Directing to the spicy. Are you fucking, are you gonna see anything? You just saw your own video. That should be good enough. What do you want from me?

22:37 You gotta, Jamaica. I don't do that. You gotta jerk him to the spicy page. I don't even think about that. I should. I should, baby. I don't even think about it. I'm just like, and you want money? I could use some, I could use some. Yeah. There you go. Because your boy ain't got he ain't got a job. What can I say? Can. That's me oversharing, that's you over sharing explicit details in spaces that didn't consent to that energy. So we're moving along. I like how we move along. Now this is one that I kind of struggle with the vibe of. I'm allowed to do whatever I want. Oh, and if you don't like it, that's your issue. You mean like for a, a couple for a couple for a single. I know I've met bulls that, that feel that way and act in that way.

23:21 I've met unicorns that feel and act in that way, and I've met Overprivileged couples Really? That have thought that way. Totes ma goats, it's a thing. It is legit. I don't think I have, and I, and I think there's several of you out there who are listening to this that absolutely know what I'm talking about. You absolutely know what I'm talking about. I don't even have to say it. I ain't have to say it. I just said it now, you know. There it is. Moving on ladies and gents. Geez. Whoa. That was heated. Oh, that was hot. So we're going over advice we hear all the time that can actually cause harm.

24:02 Now I bring this up because I've, you know, we, we rub elbows with a lot of different content creators. Mm-hmm. A lot of podcasters in this niche. Yes. And, you know, I love everybody. Everybody's got their own thing. They have in this niche. Mm-hmm. And it's fun to see everybody's differences. Mm-hmm. Uh, but I've been told by a lot of content creators or podcasters, whoever, that they don't like to educate. They're not here to educate. When people ask, well, what are swingers? Or when people ask, well, what's a, you know, what's an MFM? Or things like that, their response is, well Google it.

24:44 And you know, that just, oh, it just sticks in. That makes it cringe. Yeah. I, I don't like it. I don't like that. I don't like it either. That's a rude, Because we're in this space. For people who wanna know. I mean, we tell everybody, these are just our experiences and this can happen to you. However you take it is how you take it. But we're not educators, but we'll give you our experiences and you can take what you want from that. Yeah, totally. You know, I mean, that's just how else are you going to learn about the lifestyle if you don't educate in the lifestyle? This is true. This is very, I did quotate air quotations. People. Yeah. For those of you listening, air quotations. She did the hard quotes.

25:24 Educate. Educate. That's right. I mean. It is. Ugh. And you know, there's some people that listen to this show Uhhuh, who just love to listen to us talk. As a matter of fact, we've gotten some feedback recently from a few different people that said, look, I love your show. You guys have a lot of guests on. We really like to listen to you guys more. So that's why we're doing this show right now. Us too. Oh. Uh, and we're gonna kind of, I sing also. Uh, yeah, that's true. She does. That is a true story. That is true. So that's why we're kind of going back to our roots here. Okay. We're getting back to it. I like that. And yeah we do educate as well as try to hopefully entertain you guys. 'cause we are a loving, we want to entertain you guys.

26:07 Oh, we're entertainers. Entertainers. What is that accent you're doing? Entertainers. That's like a New York UK accent. It's you entertainers. That doesn't sound like me at all. Anyways. Any who's So advice we hear all the time, okay. That can actually cause harm. Yeah. When somebody says, just communicate more and don't actually teach how to communicate. Yeah. No. Yeah. And we've heard that before. I, well, you know, I'll be honest. I wanted to just say that before, you know, sometimes I mean, we're being honest right now. Sometimes, you know, like we do different, uh, we'll do webinars or we do live shows. Mm-hmm. Or even if we're on, uh, live on TikTok, which we do.

26:50 And if you have TikTok, you should add us both. Oh, I was, I'm gonna be on live TikTok in a little bit. There you go. You could be in our home all the time anyways. When we do these shows and, you know, we do as content creators and in this niche, we get the same question often. Yes. You know, what is a swinger? And a lot of these basic questions that Yeah. People who have been in it for at least a year will probably know. Yeah. And sometimes you get asked certain questions and you know, no matter what the answer's gonna be, you just have to communicate more. Yeah. But for people who have never had to communicate like that, uhhuh, getting that phrase, just communicate more, what the fuck does that mean?

27:32 Yeah. Like, you could tell me to communicate more. I just yelled at her yesterday about not picking up her shoes off the ground. Of course, we communicate more than I, more than you know. And then, and then you realize like that, that's silly. And then you realize that's not over communicating. That's just, uh, you know, overdramatic communicating. Yes. Uh, and then there's so many other ways to do it. And everybody has a different way of communicating a different style. I mean, we're not, yeah, we're not educators, but talk, communicate when you're not angry. Just communicate more guys. Communicate. When you're not angry. Talk. Yeah. Whatever is bothering you. Talk it out. Talk it out. Yeah.

28:12 Your partner is your partner. They're gonna love you no matter what. And if they don't tell you that, then get a new partner. Yeah. I mean, it sounds simple and it sounds crazy, but it's true. I mean, don't, don't settle. You need to be heard. You have a voice. And this is male and female. Yeah. You guys have voices. Use 'em. That is communication, the way you tell your kid to go wash the dishes or ask them a question, chat, GPT chat, GPT come to us. We have a website and you can leave questions. You can send us an email. You can A voicemail.

28:53 A voicemail. Yeah. I mean, if you have a question, we are not educators, but we will guide you as much as we can. Yeah. And you know, we even have our, uh, beyond monogamy confessional on there. That's 100% anonymous. And I, and you can tell us whatever So that, that's actually, that's a really great point. Yeah. And, and, and that's what it comes down to is just you have to figure out what your communication style is. You have to figure out how to communicate more. Yeah. And you know, if you need people to help you figure that out, there are people that, and with resources that you can reach out to. Mm-hmm. Telling people jealousy is always a personal failure instead of a signal. I have been told how toxic I was 'cause I was always jealous.

29:36 Yeah. How ugly that made me because I was always jealous. So many things, and I'm speaking because he's never jealous. I'm never jealous. Like he's jealous of our children when I feed them or I give them something and I didn't give it to him because they're freaking spoiled, man. He's jealous when our kids are with other people. That's where he's jealous. But if anybody like Yeah. Hitting on me, liking me, he's not jealous at all. This bird, this bird flies around with a cage around her. Yeah. She ain't, she ain't going nowhere. Ain't going anywhere. She ain't going nowhere. But I was always told that that jealousy was a bad thing. It wasn't until I got older that I realized it actually wasn't until I got with you and we started really communicating more that I realized what, where it stemmed from, how to control it.

30:24 And it was really communication. Yeah. How funny it was. Just talk to you. That's what it came down to. Because I think we just said in, in the last show, I still get jealous of the most Yeah. Dumbest things. Dumb. And I know they're dumb because they're mine. And I'll tell him, look, I know it's silly, but can you just do this? And he'll be like, sure. Rolling his eyes, but he'll do it. Because it's just, you know, I communicated with you. Yeah. And that's, and you know that whatever it is, I'm gonna get over it. Yeah. You know, you've, your whole point is that you want to grow to be better. Yes. And I know that, and you've always shown me that. Yeah. So it's like, yeah, okay, fine. If this is what you need for whatever you gotta do, fine.

31:05 It's not a personal failure, guys. Like, it's just, it really isn't. It's just something you're gonna have it forever. I get jealous when my kids are with, you know, their other parent, or they're with friends and I wanna see them, you know, they're not in the h Like, jealousy is jealousy. It's a failing. But, you know, the opposite is also true. And that's more my end of the spectrum. Mm-hmm. Because there's people out there who never get jealous. Yeah. And there are couples out there who, this is an issue for them because it was an issue for us, baby. It was an issue for us. You know, she, she thought that I didn't love her. Mm-hmm. Because I wasn't jealous. Mm-hmm. Uh, and it took several years for her to realize that I'm just not built that way.

31:46 I was like, he doesn't. He doesn't care. Like, but it was just that he was so, he's so secure and so confident that I was never going to stray. Yeah. And astray. I mean, I'm just kidding. I know. I know who I am. Yeah. I know who I am. I know how I am. Yeah. Uh, and frankly, I wanted to be alone before we got together. Yeah. Like, I really had to go against what I actually wanted, which was to be alone. Mm-hmm. And we entered into this relationship. Uh, you know, it's one of those things where it's like, I'm, I'm putting that off so that I could be with you. I, I'm confident. What a dumb mistake. I'm confident. You know what I mean?

32:27 Uh, and so here she is. She's still, she's still here. She ain't going nowhere. And, but, you know, that's the off, off the beaten path there. But what I'm saying is it's okay if you're not built that way and, and you know, for. For that you, you're gonna have guilt sometimes you're gonna be like, mm-hmm. I don't know why I don't feel this way. Mm-hmm. And, and you know. Did you have guilt baby? I did a little bit. Uh, you know, sometimes I had to fake like I was being jealous. Yeah. Because I knew that you liked it. It's hot. I dunno why. You know, I just, I just figure if I figured initially I figured you were too good for me. Oh. And so I always just figured, well, if one of these days she's gonna realize it and she's gonna jet.

33:10 And when that happens, I'll at least be mentally prepared for it. You know what I mean? So I've always kept it in the back of my mind. I have an exit. Yeah. Yeah. No, no. I've always had it in the back of my mind till about five years ago. Uhhuh till the pandemic Uhhuh, um, after the pandemic. And you knew I wasn't gonna go anywhere after the pandemic and after we stopped being poly. I was like, oh, this bitch ain't going nowhere. No, I just knew Yeah. That because we hit a pivotal moment when we stopped being poly. It was such a big thing. You thought that we were gonna end. I didn't realize that our relationship was as rocky as you apparently thought it was. And you know, it, it was a real big revelation, was letting communicate with you.

33:53 You didn't see. You didn't. And it was a big revelation for me. Yeah. 'cause I was just like, holy shit. We were not as solid as I had always thought we were. Yeah. I better fucking straighten up and fly Right. And figure this shit out. We did. We did. We did. And things got so much better from that. Yeah. Uh, I didn't realize so much about us up until that point. Yeah. And it's almost like we were born again as far as, uh, US relationship. Yeah. Yeah. And it's funny because. I've heard people say that about their marriage after there was like some sort of infidelity or something major, some major event has happened in their lives.

34:34 Mm-hmm. And something happened and then all of a sudden it's like, yeah. And that was our roughest part. And then we just pulled out of it together. We've been strong ever since. Mm-hmm. You know? Um, but I didn't know. I really didn't know that, that apparently our, our marriage was breaking up. I had no idea. Knew you weren't really paying attention. I had no idea. I wasn't paying attention. No, you weren't paying attention. That is fair. Yeah. I had a lot going on. But you did, you did. We both did. Had much going on. I no more. And you know what? You pay attention now. That's, but that's pretty fucking cool that we can talk about it now. Yeah. 'cause we've gotten a lot more experience through it. And, you know, I'm not saying go out there and put yourselves and your relationship in a position where you could hurt yourselves in that way or hurt your, your relationship.

35:21 What I'm saying is. Is learn from our mistakes. Mm-hmm. Is what I'm saying. Do as I say, not as I do, you know? Yeah. Learn from what we, what we almost lost our marriage on, apparently. Because we're living an incredible part of our life in our relationship, and it's only getting better. And that's because we're in a one income household right now. Like, you wanna talk about stress, bro? Stress is finances in a two person what? Four kid, five kid household. Yeah. It's a lot of people in here. Yeah. And we should be at each other's throat, but we're not, we love each other.

36:02 No. We have a, an amazing relationship. And I'm telling you, if you two are on the same page, you can only get better from there. And it takes a lot. It takes, it does. Our rule, one of our rules for our relationship is. One of us always has to apologize. Yeah. Even if you don't, it's what it's, and when I told him this, when we first got together, he was like, yeah, no, I hated it and I hated it. I think, fuck that. Maybe after years I was like, dude, I'm always apologizing to you. Like I'm done. I'm done apologizing. She did. She said exactly that and, and I think that's when he switched and he was like, oh shit. I guess I should you know, because we both also said that if it's for the relationship, we are gonna be changing whatever we have to change.

36:47 Right. I used to drink a lot. I stopped. Yeah. Um, when we first got together. Yeah. I was going through a lot of things internally. Just certain things that, that we can, that we know that in order to change, in order to make your relationship good and very, what is that like strong, you know, have a good foundation. You have to be able to. Somebody has to be the bigger person every now and then, man. Yeah. Tick that teeth. Yeah. That get that tail and stick it between your legs and just be like, I'm sorry. And it hurts like a motherfucker. And it sucks. It hurts to have to apologize when you feel you are not wrong. Yeah. Now if you have, if you have a partner that you know you can apologize to, and then that's, you know, that that's gonna start the healing process.

37:33 That's gonna start us. Yeah. Our working together. We're gonna talk this out, everything's gonna be okay, then great. If you have a partner where you apologize and then they continue on and they continue getting mad at you and continue making it seem like it was your fault, even though, uh, you know, it, it's not. Yeah. That you should probably, I don't know, consider finding a new one. Partner. Partner. That is, I'm just saying. I mean, I'm not a relationship advisor. We're not sex couches. Uh, no, we are not sex couches. But I will say that there's a lot of people who are in relationships that forget that they too have an identity.

38:15 They are an individual and what they feel And what they think are just as important as the other person in that relationship. But, you know, it takes an it takes one of them to be and you can sound, you can make this sound better, but it takes somebody who's one of the partner has to be more educated in knowing how to speak, not educated so much, but needs to know, like, when I'm upset. You know how to talk to me to figure out why I'm upset. Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm. But you've al 'cause I'm very closed off. Yeah. Even with you, like, I'm just like, just what?

38:55 I'm shut, I'll shut down. Yeah. But you learned how to break that. Now it takes a partner that knows how to do that, to break that, and the partner who is like, oh, he's just trying to help me. Yeah. Let's just figure this out. And I'm, I'm gonna say there's not a lot of people like that. You know, I, I'm sure it's different for different people, for, for me and you. I like to ask a lot of questions. Yes. And, and if there's something that I don't understand Yeah. Then I'm very much into, you need to make me understand this. Yeah. Because I can't sit here with a question and I'm a horrible explainer. Yeah. And so then I have to know how to ask the right questions mm-hmm. To get the right answers So that we can figure it out together.

39:39 Yeah. And there have been things that you were just like, I seriously, like Midcom mid, mid argument. Yes. Where you've stopped and you've been like, I have never thought of it that way before. Yeah. And that makes complete sense. Yeah. And it was like, what were we just yelling about? Yeah. Like, what just happened right now? Yeah. Yeah. I, it's, it's been, I mean, you know, we both, we both have gone through that where it's like, oh. Shit. Okay. I get it. Yeah, I get it. I get it. Because as I'm getting older, I am learning how to speak better, well, you know, I will say that you've gotten better at, at expressing yourself to me because Yeah. For so long I had to try and figure out what was wrong Yeah.

40:23 By why you were acting this way, or why you were being closed off or whatever. And eventually I just started telling you, look, I'm not gonna know if you're not gonna tell me. Yeah. If you tell me, I can figure out what the hell happened and I can fix or I can apologize. Yeah. And I tell him like, one thing he does not like, he does not like to hurt my feelings. Oh man. So if I tell him it'll upset, if I tell him, Hey, this happened and it really hurt my feelings, that will just, it'll upset him so bad. That'll set me off. That'll set me off. You would, you would think that she did something wrong and I'm not yelling at her. Yeah. I'm giving attitude because I'm upset with myself.

41:05 Yeah. That I have, and luckily for me, she knows that. Yeah. Uh, because it could come out completely fucked, but it doesn't. Luckily but yeah, I, I, I, I get very attitudey because I'm like, yeah, God, I just, I shouldn't have done that. Yeah. Whatever that was, I shouldn't have done that. And I'm like, should have known better. It's okay. Priority of your relationship over everything else. Mm-hmm. Like, that's what it comes down to. Mm-hmm. If you're in a relationship, it should be your priority over this lifestyle. I get, I get it. That non-monogamy is maybe your way of life. It is everything to you, but you have to sit back and you really have to ask yourself what is more important.

41:48 My non-monogamy or my relationship now, some people can maybe be in shitty relationships and sit back and go, yeah, I prefer my non-monogamy. Hey, more power to you. No shame in your game. Yeah. Do your thing. Yeah. At least you'll know. Yeah. But as far as my, uh, deal here, I have waited my entire life for this woman to come into my life. And when she finally did, I told myself that I would never squander an opportunity if I got it. So I got it. And there's not a single person that could have me squander that like ever. Like it's not a thing we've had people try. We have had people try.

42:28 We've had people try. Yeah. We have had people try. Wonder if those people listen to our podcast? Uh, you know, I hear that if you are successful, that haters are listening. Yeah. So it's possible. See, I'm not intimidated. I still have him. You know, and there was a lot of people that did not think that we would last very long. Yeah. Uh, there were people that were hoping we weren't gonna last very long. Yes. Uh, and there were people that were trying to prevent us from lasting very long. And it just, it, if you can put me in a setting where I'm in a, a room full of beautiful, very well formed naked women doing lots of sexual acts, the one person my eyes keep going to is this woman that sits next to me here.

43:17 And it's because, dude, I'm, I'm frigging in love and God forbid I be love God. I'd be happy in my relationship you. I, what I realize is I, I try not to say that too many times in front of people because I know not everybody has the same relationship that we do. Mm-hmm. And maybe they're not as happy and, you know, it just comes off boasty and that sort of thing. I mean, at the same time, I can't be unapologetic. We, we work very hard at this. Very hard. This, we work very hard at this. Mm-hmm. Uh, our relationship is more of a priority than other things that, that could have. And I think even more so because we're in the lifestyle.

43:58 Oh yeah. I think that you, when you're in the lifestyle, you have to put in extra work in this, you have to put an extra work to yourself and extra work to your relationship and extra work just to honestly every single little thing. Yeah. You know, Hey, I, we both had opportunities to stray at any point if we wanted to. Uh, and you know, it's like. What kind of person do you want to be? Do you want to be a better person? Do Uh, because if, if you take the bait, that's not where you're gonna go. You know what I mean? That's just not how that goes. Nope. You know, if you want to be a better person, sometimes it causes you to say, yeah, no, I can't do that.

44:38 Sorry. Sorry. But we have a rule about that, you know, that sort of thing. Like, you gotta speak up, you to, I know it feels uncomfortable, so sometimes you have to speak up, let me tell you. And if your partner says, nah, I don't want you to talk to that person, ask questions. Why? What's up? What can I help you to heal this part of you? Be open. Yeah. Yeah. And you know, also, I, I do wanna say something to there. There's, there's a lot of people out in the lifestyle who have maybe not been taught. How to do things properly, etiquette wise in the lifestyle. Mm-hmm. How to treat other couples in the lifestyle, you know, how to be respectful, that sort of thing. I think it was a, another couple that we had seen one time they said that, you know, what seems like common sense in the vanilla world is not common sense mm-hmm.

45:27 In the lifestyle world for some reason. Yeah. So for example on, on your lives, people are making comments about your cleavage as you're talking, you know, you're, you're having a conversation and you're educating somebody about something and they're like, nice cans, you know? And I'm like, God, are these adults? Like, what? And I guess because I surround myself with adults, with the adults that I surround myself with, are not like that. You know, it's, it's, uh, it's that horny brain. It's the lack of control. High sexual, you know, Hey, I'm, I'm hypersexual, but I know how to control it. I've been, yeah.

46:08 For the most part I've been controlling it my whole life. Yeah. You know, so I can be around people and not acting that way. Yeah. Unless I know I can. Yeah. Which is different. Well, there you go. You know what I mean? Mean they think they can Automatically, automatically, they're like, whoa. And so that's the thing is, you know, if, if you realize that, oh, maybe, maybe I'm that person that they're talking about, maybe I'm going about this the wrong way. You know, don't, don't kick yourself in the ass. Just try and fix it. You know what I mean? Try and better yourself in one way or another. Mm-hmm. Just a little bit. Try and learn something different. Try and, and I think the name of the game really is just respect, just comes down to respect, period.

46:51 Period. Period. Inclusive language without inclusive behavior. So we've seen that a lot. Okay. Yeah. We've seen that a lot. We've seen, so inclusive language without inclusive behavior. Right. Okay. So we've seen it where people have said, oh, we're gonna throw an bent. Now, I, I, I wouldn't say that we've seen it personally. We've been told by people mm-hmm. That this has happened. I can't say that it's happened to us. But where there's like meet and greets. Oh, so somebody will say that there's a meet and greet and the person that's putting it on is like telling everybody, oh yeah, come on in. It's a meet and greet. Uh, we're looking forward to seeing you guys, and then the people that are putting it on don't even talk to anybody outside of their own little friends.

47:40 We've actually had that happen, but I have, we had that happen. I, I don't allow that. Okay. But we've not had that happen. So if that's happened to me, I, I haven't paid attention. We've, we've gone to a party where we were invited and you can tell these people had their own little clique because all the women looked alike. And so we went to this party and we, we said hi to everybody. And we met the the, the throwers of the party and whatever. Then we went outside and we met other people and we came back in and I could see little cliques happening and I was like, yeah, nah, that's not gonna happen. Let me see which clique I wanna be in. So I'll go and I'll say hi to everybody, but That's right. I do remember that. Yeah. Like, they'll just stay in their own little, you know, world.

48:22 I didn't, I didn't realize that that's what that was, because we were popping from place to place. No, that's exactly what that was. They were all cliques. Mm-hmm. They're all little cliques. Lemme tell you. How about that? Lemme give you a little advice. Alright? If you're gonna host an event, be a host. If you need to know what that etiquette is, look it up. That's be a host. Good advice. Yeah. Don't be cliquey. Don't be rude. You know, I, I understand that. So there's, there's a big problem with, I'm just gonna say it. There's a problem with really people who believe that they're really attractive. They feel that they can't consort with people that they feel, that they feel are unattractive.

49:03 Oh, I used to be that, Because then that they're gonna get the wrong vibes. They're gonna think, oh, they wanna, oh, that are unattractive and Una Oh my God. You know what I'm saying? I was gonna say, I wouldn't talk to attractive people because I was like, oh my God, I'm, I'm too open. No, that's the, no, that's the opposite. So you're saying, what I'm saying is it's these attractive people. They don't, they know it's, I'm not even saying they're attractive. I'm saying they think that they're attractive and they don't want to talk to people that they feel are unattractive because they feel like if they're nice to them, that person's gonna think that they're gonna wanna have sex. Oh, I think, you know what I'm saying? A lot of people attractive or not think that Yeah. You probably, right. Like when we go and talk to people, I sometimes I think, oh, they're gonna, they're gonna say, they're gonna think we wanna have sex with 'em.

49:50 Really when we first got into the lifestyle. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. I remember you used to say that all the time. Yeah. Dude, you can be friends with people. No, it doesn't mean you have to have sex with them. Yeah. But in the beginning I was like, I think so. And you're like, it's not how it works. Yeah. And I was like, it it is, it is. Watch. It wasn't so, it wasn't Goes watch everything. I mean, you have the occasional one that they automatically think it, but you know, they're, they're usually new but, or actually, or just a little, A little too confidence. Yeah. Yeah. Because I have been I with you and I'm like, Uhuh. Nope. I'm telling you he's gonna wanna sleep with me. And it never fails. That's true. You have said that before. Never fail and when it comes up, it never fails.

50:30 It comes up. Yes. That's always impressive for me. Is it? I think so. Well, that's nice. So what we'd love to see more of, more grace from people learning. Yes, yes, yes. More room for reflection instead of defensiveness. Yeah. And don't forget that's that humor does not minimize harm. So you can make your jokes, but if you traumatize somebody, you then traumatize somebody, maybe try and apologize, don't make jokes. Yes. You know what I'm saying? Education that matches where people actually are. Accountability that doesn't turn into exile. Ooh, yeah.

51:10 Conversations that feel like care, not correction. Yeah. Oh, I like that one. Right. That's, mm-hmm. Well, because that's what we do, isn't it? Yeah. That is exactly what we do. So we are not here to tell anyone how to live. Not at all. We're here to say that it's okay to talk about the uncomfortable middle. Yeah. And you can love the lifestyle and still want it to do better. Yeah. You do honesty and kindness can coexist, and that's where the good stuff happens. Yes. And this is exactly what we wanted to do in this episode. We didn't want to tell anyone that they're wrong, but to open the door to better conversations. Yeah. If this is the episode that made you reflect or even feel a little uncomfortable, that's okay.

51:51 Growth usually starts here. Yeah. So if you want to keep this conversation going, head over to www.beyondmonogamy.com. You'll find all of our episodes, our blogs, the guest bios, upcoming events, our merch and our Beyond Monogamy Confessional, which is 100% anonymous. Yes. You can also catch us streaming on Full Swap radio at every Thursday at 2:00 PM and 7:00 PM Central. And don't forget my birthday parties on March 14th. Yeah. At 9:00 PM at Club Eden in San Antonio. Oh, it's gonna be on what? What's gonna. March 14th. It's gonna be on. We're gonna have a great time. There's gonna be a lot of people there. We've got the VIP area.

52:32 It is not free. So if you want to go, the invitation is open. But you do have to pay at the door or online. Yes. Uh, look up Club Eden in San Antonio. Yes. Uh, and with that, thank you all for listening and we will see you guys next week. Bye.