Kink 101: Fetish vs. Kink, Power Exchange & Hot Wifing with The Kink Consultant

0:07 All right, y'all. Before we dive in, a quick heads-up This show is raw, real, and definitely not rated PG We're talking about adult themes, sexual content, and the kinda stuff you probably don't want blasting through your speakers at work or around your kids So grab some headphones, pour your drink of choice, and get comfy Oh, and just so we're clear, we are not licensed therapists, counselors, or sex couches. Sex coaches. Sex coaches. Not sex couches We're just a couple of people sharing our lives, experiences, and sexy adventures in ethical non-monogamy. So with that, pull up a chair and enjoy the show Hello, and welcome to another episode of Beyond Monogamy.

0:53 I'm Adam. And I'm Pris. And today we are stepping outside of our usual non-monogamy lane, just for a second, and into a world that overlaps with it more than people realize, and that's the kink world. Yeah, so full transparency, we are pretty new to kink. It's only a world we've seen but not really been immersed in. So whether you're brand new and kink curious or you've been in the scene for years, today's conversation is for you. That's right. Our guest is Amanda Dames, also known as The Kink Consultant. That's right. Ooh, I like it. Yeah. She's a certified somatic sex and relationship coach and certified sexologist based out of Las Vegas, one of our favorite joints.

1:36 And she spends her days helping individuals and couples understand their kinks, build confidence in exploring them, and maybe most importantly, actually talking to their partners about them without that shame spiral. Yes. Yeah. So Amanda, welcome to Beyond Monogamy. Yes. Thank you so much- Welcome to the show for having me. Yes. You guys are in, like, my favorite stage of talking to kinksters of, like- … we're dipping our toes in and, like, we're figuring it all out and seeing- Almost … what's for us, what's not. Yes. Oh, it's so new. Yes. It's so new. Now we're gonna get all into that for, i- but real quick, uh, if this is for your first time with us, hit that follow or subscribe button everybody listening out there. Uh, wherever you're listening or watching from, it genuinely helps the show, helps the algorithm, and you don't wanna miss what's coming up later on in this episode, so we're gonna get into it.

2:25 That's right. Yes. All right. Yeah. Yeah. We are, um, brand new. So I, when I think of kink, I think of- pain, I guess. And so for me that's just not, um, pain and what I would, I, I wouldn't call that now, but what I would have thought before would be like ca- weird stuff. Like, you're gonna want pour glue on me or something. What? You know? Whoa. Like something, like something weird. And I mean, now I don't think any of that's weird, but yeah, that's, um, I think that's what I, I think of kink. I think of a weird, weird items, weird thing, and then I think pain. So those are like- Well, it didn't help that the first kink party that we ever got invited to- Oh um, we were swingers.

3:11 We were still new swingers. I think we were maybe, uh, like a third, fourth year as a swinger, and we got invited to a kink party thinking that it was similar to a house swinger party. Yeah. Um, and it was certainly not. And we saw some really interesting stuff. Yeah. We saw fire play. Uh, we saw, uh, somebody doing some knife play. We saw, uh, some spanking with like spatulas, like the literal kitchen spatulas. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. A- and, and so, uh, from, from the time that we were there, yeah, we… That was, that was very different from- Yeah … from what we were expecting. And for research purposes only, where was this party and how did you get invited? Yeah, you come on. We're not in it, but we know a lot of people, so Amanda, , I'm new to you, so tell me who are you?

3:58 What you doing? How'd you get here? Yeah. I… Okay. So I'm gonna try and like speed run the answer because I think I was born kinky. Oh. From the age of five I was obsessed with spanking. Okay. Not being spanked myself, but like if one of my friends was being spanked or like I heard that they were gonna get in trouble, I was like quietly so excited. I was like, "Oh my God," and if, God forbid, they actually got taken and spanked and then came back, I asked them so many questions. But I realized I was the only person who cared, and that was weird. So I have been like, there was, before I knew the word kink, I just thought I was weird, you know? So I understand the interchangeable words- Yeah … of like weird and kink. Yeah.

4:39 And it took me until I was about 13- To realize, like I knew it was weird, and I knew to keep my mouth shut about it and secretly be into it. Mm. But when I was 13, I was watching some TV show late night. I grew up in Ireland. I'm American born here, grew up in Ireland. Was watching late night TV in Ireland, which is much less, uh, you know, they show everything. You can see a penis on cable at like 10:00 PM at night, whereas- Oh, wow America is not like that. No. There was this couple, it was a documentary show, and they were both submissive, and they wanted to go be dommed by a dominatrix at a dungeon. And this is like a core life memory because everything clicked into place. Like, it was just like I saw things clear.

5:20 I was like, "Oh my God, this spanking thing, this punishment obsession, it's something called kink." And my mind went logically, "Okay, this is about sex, and when I turn 18 I'll just go hire a dominatrix to do these things to me- Okay. Yeah … and then life will be f- like- Yeah. Luckily, a year later, like I got my first boyfriend to spank me, and I was like, "Okay, I probably don't need to hire a dominatrix." Don't have to pay for this. However, however, fast-forward about 10 years later, first boyfriend at 14, 10 years later I move to New York City, I'm 24, and I get a job as a dominatrix in a New York City dungeon. And- Ooh … it's not my full-time job.

6:00 Okay. Full-time I'm working at the Wall Street Journal, like- Okay training their customer service agents, and then at night I finish work, and I like walk the 10 blocks down Manhattan to the dungeon I'm working at. Very sexy. And oh, it was sexy. It was sexy to live a double life, to be like- Yeah … moonlighting as a pro dom. I mean, uh, if you've never had the opportunity to have a secret life- Right I highly recommend you find a way to do it that is like, you know, consensual- Okay. … or you feel good about it. Yeah. Like, go for it. Go for it. Yeah. I've been telling her, Amanda. I tell her all the time. She doesn't listen. I'm like, Go enjoy yourself." Go live your life. I think if anyone even feels a little bit like they wanna be a pro-dom, you gotta try it.

6:41 So I was able to explore all of these sides of kink, but, you know- Mm-hmm … I fell into that trap of, oh, I need to be a upstanding member of society. I need to focus on my career. Mm-hmm. Let me leave the dungeon work and just focus on going up the career ladder, which was not a bad choice. Financially it was a great choice, but, like, my soul, I didn't realize it, was hurting. So I think- Oh … I spent a full six years fully out of the, the kink, like, professional space- Mm-hmm … until I was like, I need to find a way back. And I always thought about it. I was like, "I'd love to go be a dom again. I'd love to maybe even just manage a dungeon. I would love to make it big in corporate America, get a bunch of money, and open my own dungeon." Like, I was- Yes … just thinking of all these, like, schemes of how I would do it, and I discovered sex and relationship coaching.

7:27 So I became certified, and I thought I'd be a general sex and relationship coach, and I realized no, there are enough kinky people who have gone through the struggles I went through of trying to find a partner who understood me, my kinks, and fetishes, and I'm gonna get into that, um, that I specialized in kink- Oh as a sex and relationship coach. And, uh, I was still working my corporate America job when I started, so I, I wasn't ready to be like Amanda Dames, the kink consultant. So instead I just called myself the kink consultant. At the time, my website was thekinkconsultant.com. The name Amanda Dames was nowhere because I was- Mm-hmm still using it at Peacock where I was, like, working- Yeah … as their director of retention strategy.

8:09 And, uh, I started to make TikTok videos about kink, and it started to resonate with people, and that's… So I would say my business started then before I was- Wow … even fully- Out. Yeah. And- Now I help couples That's amazing. Yeah. I love my job too. It, it gave me a path back to talking to people about their kinks and fetishes and how to really explore them in their own life and in their marriage, as opposed to going to a dom, which I'm very pro-dungeon, pro-dominatrix- Uh-huh … pro-sex work, but there are a lot of people out there who want to explore it with their partner, and they don't- Yeah wanna go to a dungeon, and I feel like I'm helping people carve that path for themselves. That is so interesting. Oh my gosh, man. That story alone, like we talk to a lot of people on this show and that is a very, very specific story and, and what I, what I liked about it is that you knew you were kinky from way back when.

9:03 Yeah. Um, I always say that about, uh, non-monogamy. Uh, I, I knew I was non-monogamous when I was young, but I didn't know that there was a name for it. Um, and so you just kind of w- when you finally get that label or you finally realize what it is and you look back at it and you're like, "Oh, wow, okay. So this- Mm-hmm this tracks." Mm-hmm. You know? Yeah. Yeah. Uh, so I get that. This… Can I just say, this is why I love labels. I know labels have a bad rap, but until there was a name for it, you didn't fully know what to look for. Mm-hmm. You didn't know what to look for to research it and learn more- Mm-hmm … about the type of person you are. So while I don't want people to attach themselves and hold to a label really tight, I love that you were able to find the label that helped you explore more deeply.

9:47 Yeah. Well, so, you know, for us it started, uh, like I said, we, we were swingers at first. Um- Mm-hmm … and then, uh, in the, in the swinging community, people… Y- you know, we were always trying to find other couples and- Mm-hmm … and people to connect with, and there were certain websites that we would get to. Uh, but many people would tell us, "Oh, well, what's, uh, what's your fetlife? What's your fetlife?" And everybody would always ask us, "What's your fetlife?" Um, and I was like, "I guess this is another swinging website or a way to connect?" Yeah. And so I got, I, we got on our, our, our fetlife and I think that's where we got invited to, uh, our f- first party and- Yeah … we went to a kink party.

10:28 Um, now I find it completely fascinating, like I, the whole world of it. Uh, as soon as, um, I realized that kink existed and, and kinda what it is, um, it just, it, it intrigued me. Uh, when we were at the, the, that first party and the things that we saw, it was, it was incredible. Um, but my wife here had a separate reaction where it, it was kind of triggering for her. Um, she's a, uh, a, a women's rights champion and- So I would see- … that sort of thing … yeah, um, and it wasn't like trauma. I didn't… It's not trauma. It was more of protection.

11:09 So like these women would be, this woman was in a straitjacket and- Yeah … they were, like, messing with her, and she was trying to fight. She was laughing and being… And happy of course, right? They put her in that. But I didn't care for that. Like, I was like, this just felt like bullying to me. Um, and then, like, when someone is getting spanked, like, really hard, I know that they're enjoying it, but my reaction is, "Give me the fucking paddle and let me fucking beat this guy with it." Yeah. You know? Yeah. So it's, it's, it's, it… And I'm trying to, to, like, just let it kind of just, just watch and just e- enjoy, but it's like, mm, it… And it bores me, honestly.

11:49 Like, that's not something for me. Like, I literally will get bored just being there. I'm like, "Okay. Let's go." This is a really common reaction. Okay. No, this is super common. So a lot of people in the swinger and poly and non-monogamy community, they're not the same thing obviously, but s- Yeah, yeah especially in the swinger community- Yeah … where they throw swingers parties and kinksters show up, or there's kink nights at the swingers party. Yeah. Swingers will joke that kinksters must be asexual, right? Because it's like, what the fuck about this is sexy? How is this turning someone on? Oh. But it's a different form of intimacy, you know? Mm. Between people, and it's all happening, well, 90% is in their headspace.

12:31 Because to your point, how is it a turn-on to be hit with a paddle? How is it a turn-on to be bullied while you are, uh, in a straitjacket? Yeah. Right? Yeah. And it can be anti-feminist. It can be anti-, uh, masculine, quote, unquote, masculine. Mm-hmm. Some of these acts that you're seeing. And some of it's rebellion, but also some of it is this headspace of what you're actually seeing is humiliation, and that's- Mm-hmm … doing something for someone's brain. Um, power exchange, not being- Ah … in power, but really, like, secretly kind of having control 'cause you have a safe word. A lot of people enjoy the experience because they have the control behind it, and it is their escape.

13:14 Mm. And I understand because I have something called a fetish and- I'm not asexual, but for some people I could almost be considered asexual in a way. A fetish is something where you need to think about it to achieve arousal, and that has a really… Fetish has such a bad rap. Most people hear the word fetish and they think, like, freak, they're going to jail, they're doing all these illegal things. They can't help themselves except they, like- Yeah … they need to be touching feet or they're creeping on someone. All a fetish m- no, but tell me that's not what we all think- Yeah. No. … when we hear the word fetish. Yeah. I mean if- So- … and yeah, if you're not educated or at least understand it, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I only- That's exactly what they think … I remember, like, f- realizing, I thought I was kinky from the ages of 14 to 24, and then I started to do more research even, like, while having this job at the dungeon, and I realized I have something called a fetish.

14:07 And a fetish is a need to have. A kink is a nice to have. So in order to- Oh … achieve arousal, I need to be thinking about me getting punished, me punishing someone, getting spanked, but any type of punishment, like being put in the corner can turn me on. Mm-hmm. I could literally get off to just a fantasy where I got in trouble and got put in the corner by my boyfriend for some reason. Mm-hmm. How non-sexual is that? Like, it's ridiculous. Like, I've c- I, I could come to the thought of having to write lines, like old school punishment style things. Okay? Wow. I say all of this because that's an e- extreme version people might not think of but, like, uh, I, I'd put money on this, but I don't have… We're not in person right now.

14:50 I- if I asked you to name a fetish that you've heard of, I have a feeling you would say one specific fetish. So I'm, I'm gonna, like, I wanna write it down. I'm not gonna change my answer. Name a fetish you've heard of. Uh, you go ahead. Um… Or you want me to say? Go ahead. Well, the first one that comes to mind is foot fetish. Yeah. Bingo. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. That's the one. Everyone's heard of foot fetish before for two reasons. Yeah. One, it's becoming normalized, right? Mm-hmm. It's made its way into the zeitgeist. Because it's a tough economy. It has, yeah. Yeah, it's a tough economy. You gotta sell those feet pics. It's such a tough economy. That's right. Our freaking 19-year-old just said, "Mom, you should sell feet pics."

15:31 And I'm like, "Girl, I've been trying to do that." I said, you gotta step into the cake and you gotta mash your feet in. Yeah, there was a Kink of the Hill episode. Yeah. It- Yeah. It's in the zeitgeist, right? Yeah. Yeah. And there's all these theories on why people have a foot fetish, but that's only just, like, the most common one because I think it's actually one of the most normal ones. Like, I have clients who have, um, a balloon fetish, a, um, a makeup fetish of, like, a smeared lipstick fetish, you know? Uh-huh. Like, things that… And that kind of goes hand-in-hand with their smoking fetish. But my point is- Uh-huh … they have one thing or one thought that they need. I, I have a couple of clients who have enema fetishes for different reasons, and they need these things in order to orgasm. Some were born with them. Some is from trauma.

16:13 You know, it- Uh-huh … there's no magic thing that all kinks come from this. Just, you just like it. Yeah. You just like it, right? Yeah. Fetish is common and an easy one to point to because it's a very… Like, everyone sees feet. There's nothing actually dirty about it. Uh-huh. It's just some people don't like feet, and, uh, apparently some people love feet, but no one's going to jail because they love feet. Yeah. And if they are, that's an extreme, right? That's, like, a paraphilia where they are- Yes … putting themselves in danger to experience it. Right. You could also have a power exchange fetish, and the reason I'm going on this whole tangent and going deep on this is because a lot of people don't understand when their partner says they have a kink and they're like, "I need it," and they become kind of obsessed with getting it, their need met.

16:54 Uh-huh. What they're actually… Their partner actually has a fetish. Mm-hmm. And it could be a power exchange fetish, where they want that dom/sub life and they need it, whereas a kink is more- If you guys, you guys might have kinks because you're dabbling in it. And most people, it's a kink. You know? Yeah. There's, the percentage of people with a fetish is small. So most people it's a kink, and I think that it's fun and interesting to know there's a spectrum. There's the spectrum of, like, the extreme need to have in order to achieve orgasm. Uh-huh. There's the spectrum of, "Oh, let's just spice it up in the bedroom. I got these cuffs." Like, 15-year-olds are buying handcuffs at, like- Yeah, yeah … Spencer's and, like- Yeah … using them in their sex life. That's exactly my… That's, that's my very first, uh, use of handcuffs, were furry handcuffs from Spencer's, and I was 14 years old when I bought them.

17:40 Okay. You said first use. Can you walk me through the escalation of, like, what was the second use of handcuffs? Oh, I think the second use was me being, uh, put In them? Yeah. To be restrained, so. I've never had that. Okay. So you've played- So yeah. Okay. Oh, yeah. Do you have any- Yeah, no. I'm, I'm more… I, I'm probably more on that, uh, spectrum, uh, between the two of us, I think. Okay. S- And, well, I have a theory. Come on. That I, I have a theory. No, because it sounds like when you described seeing the woman being bullied and how, or being spanked and you wanted to grab the paddle. Yeah. justice is extremely important to you. Yeah. Yes. Right? Yes. And I wonder if there are fantasies that you have- There, there is that include justice.

18:24 Yeah. Okay. She's talked about actually- I, um- … um, being- And, and trying to get into that because I'm not really, I don't wanna humiliate, but I'm all for Spanking, doing, you know, to a man Being the more powerful- Yeah, being the more powerful one … one, the more dominating one. Yeah. Um- For people who deserve it, like that need to be put in their place, or just for the sake of you- No getting to be in charge? Getting to be in charge. Uh- Yeah. But also- All right. But also the justice thing, Leah. Yeah. I, I can- Yeah … I know this woman very well- Yes … and yeah, she likes the power dynamic, but- I mean, the power dynamic, but also the justice … but I think the justice part- Yeah … really trumps that because- Yeah she, because guys say stupid things.

19:08 I'm, I've heard that so much … it's, I have just started to like men again, so… Like- Yeah … there was a part of me where I was like, "Ugh, God. You guys need to just go to an island. Y'all are done. We're done." But like she- We've… I know … like she has an OnlyFans. Like, earn your way. Yeah. Hold on. Earn your way off the island. That's what you wanted, right? Yeah. Like, and there's a fantasy I'm already imagining of like you being the tester of who gets to- Yeah … like you being the queen- Who gets to stay … in charge of like who, who's coming off the island. Sorry, I didn't mean to cut you off, but I was like- Yeah, no, yeah "Let's go with this fantasy." That's really the struggles that she's had with her OnlyFans is that she's not one to, to placate to men. Yeah. She, she's more of a, a, a, she plays almost an alpha role around a lot of men.

19:52 Yeah. Um, and so that was something that she had discussed before Exactly. Okay. So- Exactly … well, you probably have to suffer a lot of fools, but your point is you don't suffer fools. Yeah. And that's your OnlyFans, like, persona too. You're like, "I don't suffer fools," so we're gonna- Yes … we're gonna hear about it. Okay. Yes. I think you were not wrong. When you think of kink, you think of pain. Mm-hmm. Because that's also one end of the spectrum. Mm. That's BDSM. Mm-hmm. Bondage. Yes. Dominance, submission, discipline, sadomasochism. Yeah. There are too many letters. Like r- there are too few letters, actually. It should be like BDSSM. Yeah. That's how the acronym should go.

20:34 You're not wrong when you think of those things, but the fantasies you're imagining, that's also kink. It's playing with power. It's playing with justice. It's role-playing and pulling these things in, and that's what I love about kink. It is… The spectrum is so wide, it includes a lot of different things, and almost anything can be kinky. So, like, y- you may be the less kinky one, but your- Uh-huh … fantasies may be way wilder. Yeah. You know? Probably. And more intricate. I don't know. Yeah. What, what do you guys think? Yeah, probably. I mean, I am the quieter of it. Like he, he's the one that, like, kinda like pushes me to like, if we're talking about something. But once I get started, it's like I've just gone off the board and just- She used to lead me.

21:20 Yeah. When we first started in the, in the swinging lifestyle, she used to kind of lead me. She was the one to go, "Oh, let's try this. Let's go over here. Let's go do this." Yeah. Um- Oh … that has changed a lot as we've gone through and I guess we've done more research and whatnot. And, um, she's more reserved now. Yeah. Uh, actually her fantasies are pretty… Yeah … she really doesn't have very many. I think the one currently is a gang bang, uh, is your primary fantasy. Yeah. But, uh, I've always tried to kind of goad it out of her because I've always been the one who's very vocal about my fantasies and this and that. Um, and I'm always like, "What's your fantasies?" And she's like, "Eh, I just… I'm chilling." I've… Well, when, when I go back to it, when it's like, when it's in this, it's always the, the guy.

22:04 Like, I'm like, I always wanna be like the alpha, and I always wanna be like the one spanking them or doing something. Um… Do you ever have pegging fantasies? I, I don't wanna put you on the spot. No. No. Okay. Like me pegging somebody? Yeah. No. I- Have I think a- I don't like anal play in any way That's fair Yeah. Um, done it- But she likes the idea of fucking another woman- Yes with a strap-on. Yeah. Okay. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. That's, that works, too. That, that- I was just thinking of, like- That, I forgot about that, but that's an extreme- Yeah … turn-on for you. Yeah. That's a very- Oh … big turn-on for me. We did forget about that one. Yeah. I, okay, so strapping, yeah, 'cause I was gonna say, like, have you ever seen yourself, like, strapped before?

22:47 No. 'Cause it- But I had somebody w- use it on me. Like, they were strapped, and she was using it on me, and I was like, "Oh my God, that's so hot," so yeah. No, I have not, yeah. Sometimes I look at photos of myself strapped from years ago- Ooh … and I still think they're the sexiest photos I own. Yeah. Because there is something about society telling you men are so strong. Like, men- Yes … men have all the power, and then you're like- Yes … you put a strap-on on, and you f- you're like, "I kinda get it," you know? Yeah. Like, I see why they're so happy- Yeah … with themselves 'cause I was- Yeah … happy with myself. And I just think it's a fun thing to explore, but yeah, if you ex- just strapping, it doesn't even have to be with men. It doesn't have to be- Yeah … anal. It could be with women. That's an idea That is a big one, yeah. Yes.

23:27 Yeah. So I swear to God, my job is not just running around encouraging people to try new kinks. Being like, "Go on, put the strap-on on. You'll love it." But sometimes it is sort of like, well, let's go deeper on your fantasies, especially when I'm working with a couple where one person- Mm-hmm is kinkier than the other. I wanna make sure both people's fantasies have center stage at different points, you know? Yeah. Because I feel for the, quote-unquote, "non-kinky" partner when they come to me, 'cause it's like, "Oh, I'm just here to accommodate his kinks," or vice versa. So I was gonna ask you. Yeah. Yes. And I'm just like, normally I… Everyone who's listening, like, I will put the kinky person on the back burner for a second 'cause I'm like, "No, you're sorted. You know your kinks." Yeah.

24:11 We need to talk to the person who's like, "I don't have fantasies," because- Yeah … you do, you know? Yeah. Most people do. They might just be deeply buried, and I'm not saying- Mm-hmm I have a 100% success rate with finding someone's fantasies, but I'm gonna say it's, like, 99% of finding someone's fantasies. Wow. So I like working with… And I prioritize working with the person who says they don't have fantasies, so we're at a level playing field- Mm. Mm-hmm … and both people are having their needs met, because it's just not a sustainable thing- for one person to constantly be in service of the other and their desire. Yes. Yeah. And I guess that's- Yeah … that's hard because I sometimes wanna be very alpha to him, and he's like, "Yeah, no."

24:54 I mean, it- Like, I have to tell him days in a- … I'm not used to it, so sh- I'm like- Yeah … just tell me ahead of time that that's what you're gonna do. And it's like, that isn't- Well, because we've been together almost 16 years, and she has always been very submissive- Yeah … to me in bed. Uh, so it's like, whenever you want it, however you want it, it's all you. Like, whatever fantasies you have. Like, that's the only time that she's really submissive is in bed. Yeah. Yeah. And I'm the only person that she's with. Um, so as of lately, well, since the podcast, uh, she's started to kind of be more open to other ideas and kind of- Yeah … listening to herself and her, her thoughts and what she wants to explore. And she got it in her head that, hey, you know, I think I'd, I'd really like to dominate men in- Yeah in some way.

25:37 And I said, "Well, I don't- Yeah … I don't know what that entails. That's a completely different thing for me." But how do you do that when, when… Like, when the couple… Like, it's a couple, okay? So- Yeah … like- Yeah … when I wanna be the one, like, it's hard. I mean, I'm down for it. It's hard for me to tell him, "Hey, um, it's you." But I'm not used to it, so then I kinda fight against it. Yeah. And so we just end up switching again, and it's like, okay. I'm a… So first of all, I am a huge fan of open communication- Yes … but I have a mini hack that I like to suggest to people in this situation- Okay … 'cause it's very common, right, for switches or people who wanna switch it up. Yeah. I one time bought this $20 light at Home Depot that I could change colors on, and I do recommend if you are feeling more dominant, you put that light in the kitchen.

26:20 And people will ask, 'cause I've done this. Like, people will be like, "What's this light?" And you're just like, "I just like pink light, so I have this light in the kitchen." Oh my God- But- … that made my stomach… But you just… Like, everything I know what you're about to get to is very exciting. Go ahead. You just… Well, I hope this is what you're thinking. Like, you change the light on the day you wanna be more dominant to give them- Yes … like, start prepping the head space. And while I firmly fall on the side of let's have open discussion, we all know sometimes you just want the illusion- of it just happening naturally. Yes. Do you know what I mean? Yes. So you avoid that conversation. Yeah. I would recommend please have the conversation. Maybe on the first of the month you have the conversation of- Yeah … "This is something I want to explore. When I'm feeling in my dominant energy, I'm going to signal to you."

27:03 Yeah. "And, like, we might have code words or something like that. And, like, let… Just know that I'd like to explore it." And that gives your partner an opportunity to see that blue light and be like, "Today's not the day, I'm sorry." Or- Yeah, yeah … go keep that blue light on and just, like, let it go into the evening when playtime happens. And I think that we sometimes overthink it because- Sex just happens, and sometimes a partner goes all day thinking, "I'm about to have sex," and there's no light on or anything like that. There's just a random text, and there's no like- Yeah, yeah … " Fuck off, I'm not in the mood." It's just sort of like I'm just gonna turn them down in the bedroom. So I encourage more communication than less, right? Mm-hmm.

27:44 I think sometimes we overcomplicate it, and just a little bit of a like, "Hey, I'm in the mood," without saying, "Hey, I'm in the mood," can work. Yeah. That's frigging genius. I know. And I would've never thought of that. That's the simplest thing in the world, and I would've never thought of that. But that's, I, if I see a certain light, like if we've already talked about it- Put the light, put those touchy lights everywhere … I'll be like Pavlov's dog. Yeah. You can ring that bell, girl, all day long. And I, you, 'cause I'm, I'm do- I like an aggressive woman. I, I, I dig the idea of her being dominant. Um, I'm just not used to it. Yeah. And that's what I was explaining to her. I'm like, "You gotta understand. You got, you've got me conditioned to be this way. When we first got together, I was very independent. Uh- Yeah … and now I'm, I'm very codependent." You know?

28:26 And so, you know, and, and that's how she's got me and, and so she's got me trained a certain way where it's, oh, well she's always been submissive in bed, and now all of a sudden it's, well, I wanna dominate. And it's like, oh, okay, cool. Let's- Mm-hmm … let's do that. Um, what day? Yeah. What day are we talking about? You know? Is it a Wednesday? But then it's like the energy has to be right too. Yes. Yeah. 'Cause do you ever just wake up and you're not feeling dominant? Oh. Or you wake up and you're like, "Oh, I need to take charge," and your- Yes even your body language changes. Yeah. Those types of things make… That's what makes kink and switching in kink slightly more complicated- Mm-hmm … because you're not playing the same role all the time, and it's that communication thing.

29:07 Yeah. So a lot of my kinky clients come to me for this exact scenario, and I'm happy to share the light bulb story- It's funny … 'cause I'm like- I love it … "Try that please." Yeah. Yeah. Like, "Come back and tell me what it is." But also, I'd love to tell you that I do have this free guide called Speaking Your Desires With Confidence. Mm. Because I have so many non-kinky and kinky- couples- Yeah, yeah and they need to navigate this conversation from zero. I mean, you two are very open. You've explored non- Yeah … monogamy and you live it. But if you are five years into a relationship and one of you is like, "Oh, no, I'm kinky and this is not going away, and I need to talk about it," my worksheet is designed for couples to go through together.

29:52 Mm-hmm. But it helps navigate. It's like five or six pages long with like text boxes that you can fill in on your laptop. It's… You don't need to print anything out. But it allows you to explore your own desire, learn how to put it into words for your partner to understand- Mm-hmm … and then talk about it together. And it's all about, like my point with the light bulb, I want people to strive for the fun side- Yeah … and then communicate, right? So like think about your fantasies. Think what makes it exciting to you. Go beyond what the kink itself is because- Mm-hmm … if the kink specifically is, "I wanna be handcuffed," to someone who has zero interest in handcuffs that might be like, "No, that's weird. I don't like that." But if you say, "I wanna be handcuffed because I love to feel like I'm not in control."

30:38 Yeah. A feeling can elicit empathy, whereas the kink itself, it's very easy to disconnect from. Mm-hmm. So I want, if you present your kink to your partner, go beyond what the kink itself is. Like, "I like to be spanked." No. I feel, I like to feel like you're watching out for me, and if I do something wrong you're gonna catch it, so I don't… I always call it falling too far, 'cause I have this fear- Oh … I'm just- Yeah. Now- You know this from the pre-interview. I have this fear I'm gonna let my life fall apart … for some reason. And that spanking or that punishment allows me to feel like someone's wa- looking out for me, and it, it creates a feeling of safety in me. So talking about the feeling is a lot more understandable for my non-kinky partner.

31:19 My partner is kinky- Uh-huh … but I've had non-kinky partners, instead of just saying, "Spank me." Because spanking could mean like two swats before they- Yeah … you know, put their- Yeah … dick in me, to be blunt. Yeah. Right. Yeah. Hey, so we wanna talk about something that actually is kind of important before we move any further Yeah, ProDX Health, and here's why we love them They do at home testing. Like, you get a kit, you do it at home, you mail it back STIs, hormones, real stuff that you should really actually know about Yeah, and there's no waiting room, there's no awkward conversations, none of that You just get your results, and if you need next steps, they help you with that too Look, knowing what's going on with your body is just part of taking care of yourself and the people that you're with Very true.

32:10 It really is. And ProDX Health makes it so easy, there's really no excuse not to That's right. Use code BAOMONO at prodxhealth.com. That's 15% off year-round, even more during special events Link is in the show notes. Okay, now back to it Back to it Wow. Yeah. Huh. You know, well, so it's, it's, it's one of those things where I've always been open to different experiences, and especially now since, since we got the podcast. Mm-hmm. I'm a big believer in I can't say I don't like something if I haven't tried it. Yeah. Um, and there's a lot in the kink community, uh, or in the kink world that I have not tried. Um, w- when I'm asked, and I'm asked this often, uh, what my kink is.

32:56 You know, this… A lot of times swingers will throw kink around, and I don't think that they really 100% know, uh, what the real definition is, but they'll- Yeah often ask, "What, well, what's your kink?" Um, and mine has always been pretty much the same. You know, we're exhibitionists. Mm-hmm. We're voyeurs, and, uh, I have a hot wife kink. Uh- Yeah … very, very much so. Um, but sh- that is something, and this is where we've always differed, is that I have a hot wife kink. She doesn't share that- Yes with me. Yeah. And so, like, it's different, it's, it's different kinks. Now, we figured I do have a You had mentioned that a fantasy… Not a fantasy, a, um, let's see.

33:39 It was a kink and a fetish. Yes. The fetish is you wanting that. Need it. Needing it, that, needing that. So yeah, so I think that would be your fetish. Oh, you know what? I think that's a good point. That's… The hot wife is his fetish. Like- You- so I can orgasm from regular sex with my wife. Yeah. Um, just her and I one-on-one. But oftentimes, uh, if she wants to get me there quick or, you know, anything like that. She's talking about me and somebody else. Yeah, I mean, pretty much. And, and- Yeah … and boy, that'll get me going, uh, like quick, you know. Oh, and I, I would like to point out that that's an amazing way to explore it.

34:19 A fetish doesn't always have to actually happen. You could be run- your partner… Admittedly, your partner could never know you have a fetish because you r- I've had whole- That's what I was gonna ask you six-month relationships where my partner had no idea about my fetish because I just- Yeah … like during sex I would imagine it and never let… Sometimes I would put my hand over their mouth if they were trying to dirty talk- Yeah … something that wasn't working for me and I'd run the fantasy in my head. And not enough people realize you can do that and it's not cheating, you know? What is that called? Compartmentalize. Mentalize Oh, Compartmentalize … you're compartmentalizing it. I can totally do that. Yeah. Like, I can totally do that, so I totally… Yeah, I understand what you mean. It's okay to do that. Mm-hmm. F- for example, but I, I really do encourage people, like if that's not your kink but you can dirty talk about it.

35:05 Yeah. Like you're- Yes … making your partner's fucking night. Yeah. By like- Yeah … playing that. That I can do. Yes. Especially if… Well, what's interesting is you're non-monogamous, voyeurs- Mm-hmm … exhibitionists. If you don't mind me asking, what is it about hot wifing that is not for you? Like is it- Um, and it's not, no, no the coercion and- Oh … uh, enacting. Oh. What he means is what I don't, I don't share the same kink is I don't like him to go and play with somebody and then come back and tell me about it. Yeah. He w- Got it … he likes me to tell him about it. And, and I love to ex- to tell him. You'll do that. I love to do that, yeah. It's the I don't need to know about yours, like what you did.

35:46 Yeah. Now, now I will switch this up a little bit. I like him to tell me how his experience was only if he's inside me and only if I have asked him. So like, and then I'll be like, "Okay, well, who was better? Tell me, like, tell me who's better." Okay. You know, things like that. So that's the more dominant part that I will do with him after he's like… That's the only part of, like, hot play or whatever that's called- Okay … that I like. Yeah, 'cause, okay. Hot play. First of all, strong boundaries. You know what you are and are not okay with, and you are sticking to that. So, like, I try and celebrate that whenever I can so people see what healthy boundaries look like. Yes, yes. That was a healthy boundary. Well done.

36:26 And yes, I would call that hot husbanding. Hot husbanding. Yeah. Because your actual limit is- Yeah … you don't wanna hear about him hot husbanding and being, going off with someone else. You are not going to actually find a lot of enjoyment in hearing the story unless you ask for it yourself- Mm-hmm … to hear it. Exactly. I like that. In non-monogamous relationships I've explored, the jealousy aspect turned me on, so I was almost, I guess, a cuckquean. Like, if they went off and, like- Yeah … had sex with someone else- Yeah … I- Yeah … I became extremely jealous, and I found out, for me, that can't be part of a healthy relationship for me- Yes … because my jealousy takes over. And that's why I'm monogamous but completely celebrate non-monogamy, 'cause I've seen- Yeah.

37:10 Yeah … how it can be fun and exciting. It's just not my relationship type- Yeah … that works for me. And once again, that's, like, my soapboxing of, like- Yeah. … no matter what relationship type you're choosing for yourself, that's because it's your choice, and I am so sick of people tearing down each other's relationship choices. Right. You guys don't do that, but, like, the amount of times- Yeah … I even see on social media, maybe I'm too chronically online, but monogamous people hating on people- Yeah … not even affecting them- Yeah … living their non-monogamous life, and vice versa. It's like- Yeah, you, you really- … we're allowed to have our relationship. You see, you see it bump heads constantly. You know what's funny- Yeah … is that when it comes to the, the hot wifing, for me it, I, I get the jealousy thing.

37:53 Um, and it… So it spurs a jealousy, but not a bad jealousy. It, uh, it almost- It makes me jealous to the point to where I sh- tell her, "Hey, okay, so now you come back to me- Mm-hmm because however good of a, an experience you had, I'm gonna make sure it's better." Yeah. Like- I love it. … I'm gonna outdo whoever you've just had a great experience with, and we're gonna talk about what they did right, and then I'm gonna show you that I can do it better. Yeah. So that's the… I mean, so I do- You know? Um- … like it, but I don't. So like I, I, my… I'm very jealous. I'm a very jealous person. Um, and he knows h- I'm a jealous person. Yeah. And a very, um, territorial person.

38:37 Yeah. So that's all… It's very hard. It's very hard for me to, So why are we non-monogamous? Yeah. I like to live on the edge. I get that too. That's what it is. Yeah. I like… That's why I like- He's… Yeah … pain and my, the l- life I've chosen. Can I ask, uh, is, would you consider that reclamation s- like you're reclaiming- Yes. Yes … your partner? Yeah. Okay. Yeah. So you enjoy reclamation sex- Yeah … and that intimacy adds- Yeah … to the experience for you both. Yeah. Absolutely. Explosive. And we figured that if we have really good sex and before he goes and meets with somebody Um, that's me putting in his head, "Hey, this is the best you're ever gonna have. Like, you're gonna go fuck whoever you want, but right here- Yeah … this is the golden cookie." Which we found was- A big turn-on for me a big turn-on for her.

39:22 Yeah. So it was almost like- So they do have some. … reclaiming was my thing and pre-claiming was her thing- Yeah … because she got off to that. Yeah. You know? I am obsessed with the cyclical nature of you guys' sex life. Like the, the, like like we have the pre-claiming, the- Yeah … um, non-monogamy. Yeah. The reclaiming. Yeah. And just the continuous like it- you're feeding off each other, and that- Yes … just keeps the momentum- Yeah … going. Yeah. That sounds hot as fuck. No, I've never had this specific conversation about people's, um, like the pre-claim and the reclaim- Yeah … and how that works- Yeah … for both of you. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, it's- We just, we just realized that … it's really… Yeah, that really just came up because we started exploring friends with benefits individually.

40:06 Uh, so that sent me off to an excursion with somebody without her there. Yeah. And so this was really the first time that she had to do that since we were poly. We were poly like for five years a while back. Um, and so this was really the first time that I had- Mm … gone off without her, and this is how she handled it. She was like, "Okay, this is what we're doing." That was like a little stuck- Yeah … kink life script. And, and she was, and she was dominating. Worth saying. Yeah. She was, she was dominating- Yeah … in doing that. I really was. Yeah. And it, it was, it was very hot. It was very hot. I liked it. It was. Yeah. This… It is really hot. I understand it. Like, and that's another thing I love about kink and fantasy.

40:47 Like, I don't have to live this life, but I can fantasize it. Yeah. I can fantasize. Like, and I do have fantasies of my partner sleeping with someone else and me being extremely jealous. Yeah. Because I like to play with the jealousy aspect. It's the reality of jealousy that doesn't work for me. Yeah. It doesn't add to my- Mm-hmm … experience at all. Yeah. See, I… And I'm not… Outside of what I feel that brings me to that sexual dynamic, I'm not a jealous person. Mm-hmm. Uh, so I don't really experience that kind of jealousy. She can go, uh, talk to whoever she wants, and I don't feel any kind of, uh, issue with it. Yeah. When it comes to sexually, I'm like, oh man, I have like true compersion.

41:28 I'm like, man, she… I hope she has a great experience, but also it spurns this little bit in me that I'm like, "I'm gonna fuck the hell out of her after this is all done." Yeah. And she's gonna remember my experience more so than that person. You know what I mean? I love that. It's- Yeah, 'cause o- otherwise I'm not, I'm not really jealous. Yeah. I feel that. You're, you're hyper-aware of where you are jealous and you're like, "This is the one point I'm jealous in," and then nothing outside of that. Yeah. But to your point, people, swingers will ask, "Are you kinky?" Or, "What are your kinks?" Mm-hmm. And it's interesting because these are… They're not swinger kinks necessarily, but- Mm-hmm they are more on the sexual side of kink.

42:09 This would be the more sexual end of the spectrum of kink versus- Mm … the asexual side that I was describing, like me writing lines, getting turned on by myself. Yeah. But I love that you guys, you know your kinks. You just listed them all off very clearly. Yeah. And- Wow you know what they are. But I was surprised, I was on a kinky cruise earlier this year, um, and later this year I'm doing, um, Swinkation, which is a swingy, kinky vacation in Jamaica. And- Is that with The Accidental Swingers, right? Oh. Yeah. Yes. Yeah, yeah, we had them on the show. Okay. They're, they're great. Yeah. So, um, I'm gonna be there teaching sensual spanking classes, I think, is what I'm calling it, and, uh, fantasy mapping, the way I just talked to you about how you are mapping your fantasy.

42:52 Yeah. Or, you know, it's like, oh, I'm, I'm sensing interest in, uh, justice. Yeah. Working with people to do that for themselves, 'cause that's like my favorite workshop to do. I bring people on stage, and like, we map their fantasy together. But- Um, I was surprised at how much the overlap is growing. There was a time when I first got in the community, kinksters were on the left, swingers were on the right, and these two people never met. And now I am meeting… I was shocked at some of the swingers I met and how deeply kinky they were. I was like- Oh, yeah … "What, what is this new world that I'm-" Yeah … "discovering?" Well- Yeah … uh, you know, I'm not gonna lie, I didn't even really know what… I didn't even know BDSM and kink stuff intertwined in the lifestyle for a long time, especially BDSM.

43:40 Like, I did not even- Yeah, we went- … know about that … we went to a hotel takeover, and they had different rooms, themed rooms, and there was, uh, electroshock- Electroshock play. Yes. And then there was, um, there was a St. Andrew's cross- Yeah … in another one. Mm-hmm. You got flogged- Mm. I got flogged … on that one. Um, you know, and that's really w- it's events like that that we've attended that kind of got us to step in the door a little bit and go, "Ooh, okay. What's happening here?" Yeah. Um, and then we, the club that we go to has a whole BDSM area, uh, that is popping off the hook on Saturday nights, and they- Yeah … have a kink night on Thursday nights. Yeah.

44:20 Um, so, you know, stuff like that, it, it's more prevalent. And of course, now we have the podcast. We talk to everybody. Yeah. Um, and, and you realize that kink is very, very involved- Yeah in, in the lifestyle. And I think it's becoming more involved. Like, I know that I am not a full-fledged member of the swinger community, right? But I have a lot of swinger clients because kink is taking off so much in the swinger community. They wanna learn how to explore kink safely in ways that help them understand what to do and not to do. Mm-hmm. So I've learned a ton about the swinger community from swinger clients coming to me and being like, "I wanna learn to dom.

45:01 I wanna learn to flog. I wanna learn to do-" Yeah … "these things," uh, just to be more integrated in that aspect, in that side of the lifestyle that wasn't as overlapping 10 years ago. Like- Mm. Even if you talk to- That's true … swing, the swincation people, the accidental, uh, swingers, they, I think, also realized that 10 years ago it wasn't one and the same, and they are doing active work to bring the communities together in more places- Yeah … than just the local clubs. Yeah. Which I love. Yeah. You know, it's fascinating that, one, that the kink community is associated with non-monogamy. 'Cause I tried to explain that to somebody once where it's like, yeah, all three communities are, are under the umbrella of non-monogamy, but not all kinksters are non-monogamous.

45:50 Yeah. Yep. And not, not all swingers are kinksters. Mm-hmm. Yeah. And I've noticed where, I've noticed the… That's where I, when we go to the club is where I see more of the spanking and the s- and, like, we'll be having sex- Or Shibari I'm like, "Oh my God, she's getting her ass like-" Oh, yeah … spanked." And I'm like, "Ugh." I find it fascinating, yeah And I've had people come up to me at, like, the swinger vacation who think I'm in a lot of pain and that my boyfriend is spanking me wrong, and I'm like, "No, this is what I'm gonna think of tonight." And to that point, when I used to be a dominatrix, I figured out that when I thought I was going just a little too far, and I always played with safe words. If they used their safe words, I didn't go beyond it. Yeah. But I would think like, "Oh, I took them too far." They might even think, "Oh, I'm on the verge of a safe word."

46:33 And the following week they'd come back and they'd be like, "I kept thinking about that thing you did." And it was the thing we were both like, "Oh, this is too far." Yeah, yeah. But their excitement lived in what was too far, you know? And then they- Yeah … we may not even go back there, but knowing that I could go back there excited them. The fear of it. So I think, like, when we're watching these things, we don't understand what turns people on and what's going through their head, because I've even been at parties, spanking parties, I go to tons of them, and I see someone in a scene and sometimes I'm like, "Should I intervene?" And I have to remind myself this is their scene. They both have safe words. Mm-hmm. These are grown-ass humans. They're in their, like, 50s or 60s. Yeah. I think that they can handle themselves, and it's not my place.

47:16 But, like, it's… You're, you wanna save people. You wanna make sure they're okay. Yeah. That's the empathy in us- Yeah … being like, "Is this actually okay?" And for them it is. Yeah. I love that. That's great. You know, I… So I, I have a few questions here that are, are very BDSM specific, uh, that I was hoping to ask, uh, on behalf of our listeners that are- Sure … are maybe like us and, and, and are wanting to know a bit more. Um, can you break down the dom/sub dynamic for someone who's- Yeah, 'cause I don't think- only ever seen them in movies or books? Yeah. 'Cause that's- Oh. And- We don't really know too much about that. Yeah. So it's a relationship dynamic where people choose to play specific roles.

47:58 The dom/sub dynamic, where dom stands for dominant, sub stands for submissive, is a traditionally… It, it's like a power exchange role play. And the reason I call it a role play is I always say you can be in a 24/7 dom/sub relationship where you defer to your dominant to make decisions or come up with routine and enforce certain rules, and you're the submissive and you follow. But if you two show up to the hospital together and you have to take your dom to the hospital, that's no longer your dom. You're partners. Yes. So it's, it's an elaborate role play that we choose to be in 24/7. I myself am in one, but there are days where I wake up and I'm like, "I'm not in the mood. Don't even tell me what to do right now." Right?

48:41 Mm-hmm. Yeah. And it's a conversation because you're not just flipping the script im- immediately. But my point is dom/sub dynamics- are huge role plays. And yes, you can live by it 24/7, never take a day off, but at the end of the day, you have to remember you are still a human with rights, and divorce can happen if you guys are married. Real life happens and these relationships can end. So it's still a role play. And, but within that, you design it with your partner. You decide how it's supposed to look, what's going to be included and what's not, and there's no one way to do it. But ultimately, it's about exchanging power with your partner and playing different roles than you would day to day.

49:24 Yeah. Yeah. So that's my best, easiest way to describe it because it's so deep. Like everything we've spoken about today, it's a spectrum. Yeah. Like, I've known people in a 24/7 high-protocol relationship where when the submissive in the relationship… Well, when the dominant came home, the submissive knelt down immediately, and that was every single day, and that's a high-protocol thing, I think. It's not- Yeah. Yeah … it's not like I don't do that in my relationship. Yeah. And you have to ask everyone, "Well, what does that mean to you? What does that look like for you?" Yeah. But high level, what I said is, I think is applicable across the board, is just how deep people go within that role play. Mm-hmm. Totally.

50:05 Well, so when it comes to the finished scene, what's aftercare? Like, w- what does it- Yeah … why does it matter so much, really? Okay, so I love that question. When you go… I even think sometimes during sex, being penetrated can be quite an invasive experience. Yeah. And you are letting someone… You've been vulnerable with someone in a way that even being dominant can be quite vulnerable because you're testing the waters. They could laugh in your face if you give them a command or tell them to do something. Mm-hmm. It's vulnerable to try and take control because you don't know how it's gonna go. And after that type of interaction, that exchange of energy, that presence and vulnerability, you want to sort of close the vulnerability gap.

50:51 You know, like, you open your body up to someone, you wanna close it gently and make- Mm-hmm … sure everything goes back the way it was supposed to go as gently and safely as possible. In t- in cases where there's impact play or even just energy exchange, we can have a rush of endorphins. Mm-hmm. Um, we can almost experience a high that we call subspace. There's a dom version of that called flow, where the dom is just in that I'm in charge, and they're running off the energy of being in charge. Coming down from that elevated mental, emotional heightened state can feel- Mm … like a major crash 'cause really you're coming- Mm-hmm … down to baseline, but you've been so high, you feel like you just fell down to Earth, and it hurts almost, at least emotionally.

51:36 So aftercare is that moment where you reconnect. You're like, we are meeting as one. We are both out of our roles. You can do aftercare still in your role, but it's how can I be here for you to soften the fall? What do you need? Mm-hmm. And both partners should do that. Obviously, the sub or the person playing the bottom role, the person having things done to them, should get that care first because they are in- Mm-hmm the more vulnerable state. Yes. But the dom then should also get it. And aftercare is different from feedback, so you bring each other down to your like level foundational state. Sometimes that even h- doesn't happen until the next day. But then the step after that is, how did that feel? What felt good?

52:16 What could we do again next time? How could it be improved? What should we never do again? Uh-huh. You know, you check in with each other and you learn from it. So aftercare and feedback are separate, but they're both very important parts of what happens after play. And what people want as aftercare can look different. Some people want soda. Mm. They want chocolate. Um, I need attention. I wanna feel like I wasn't used, so I actually say negotiate the aftercare you need beforehand so that you make- Mm-hmm … sure you get what you need. And my aftercare is, I need you to text me the next day. And if I've actually said I can't play with you if someone says, "Well, I have a heavy business," like, "I have a heavy meeting day tomorrow, I can't really text," I'm like, "Then I can't play with you 'cause I will feel shit about myself, and I will feel used."

53:00 Gotcha. So know what you want, and don't be afraid to ask for it, and if you're feeling uncomfortable asking for it, check in with yourself. Yeah. Do you feel uncomfortable 'cause you generally don't feel well, feel good about holding your own boundaries? Or does this person make you feel not valid enough to need your, what you need? Mm-hmm. In which case you probably shouldn't be playing with them. So it's a great exercise to advocate for your aftercare needs before you start playing to make sure you two are on the same page. I like that. I never thought… I mean, I never thought about aftercare even after any type of penetration. Like, that's really… Or any type of play that's- I mean, would cuddling be considered?

53:41 I mean, that'd be kind of like aftercare Or it'd be whatever they want. It could, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it could if they want it. Yeah. But like, you, like there's, there are people who don't wanna cuddle after sex. Yeah. And I respect that boundary, and that's why I say talk about it beforehand. If you're gonna… Oh my gosh, I can't even imagine being in a one-night stand and- I don't think anybody's- Yeah … ever asked that, like, you know, like, "What, what do you want," you know, "what's your aftercare look like?" It's a really good freaking question. And that's funny because you always told me that I'm not allowed to cuddle with anybody. Mm, yeah. Ooh, sorry. Okay. Another strong boundary, right? Yes. It's like, "I can't have you do this." I hope that someone asks you in advance about the aftercare they need, because you're not allowed cuddle, right?

54:23 Right. And I think that- I don't think anybody… That's a normal question to ask. Like, it should be, but it's not Yeah, it should be. Yeah. So I want more people asking, like, ask what af- and you could lead that by saying, "What aftercare do you need?" And if they say, "Well, I wanna be held," you could say, "Well, actually, that's a boundary in my relationship. I don't cuddle people because-" Yeah "… that goes against what passes in my relationship." Pris- Priscilla's crazy. Because my wife says I can't. But I- Well, I didn't wanna put it that way. But yeah. And that's valid. I mean, that's what I'm hearing. That's valid. It's- Let's be honest here. Yeah. Yeah, no, it is … it's not invalid. That's a boundary. Yeah. And you need that to feel safe in your relationship, and I think the open communication piece is super important so that- It really is no one's feeling hurt after.

55:06 Yeah. Yeah. Like, you advocated for your need of no cuddling or I'll feel hurt. Yeah. And other people need to advocate for their need of, "Hey, I need cuddle." Like, for example, if you weren't allowed text me the next day because Priscilla won't like, Pris won't let you. Yeah. I'd be like, "I really respect that, but I can't play with you then 'cause I'm just gonna feel used." Yeah. Even though I- See … understand you're not using me, you know? Yeah. The butterfly effect and the whole thing changes. That is so… That's- Yeah … very well put, ma'am. I like that. Thank you. Yeah. I enjoyed that. So this has been such a good, refreshingly honest conversation, Amanda, so thank you, thank you, thank you. Um, but before we let you go, you're gonna tell all our listeners where they can find you, where all your work is, where… Or or where they can check out your own show.

55:54 There you go. That part. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Here's where you can find me. You can go to my website, amandadames.com, and my free guide is in there. If you scroll to the bottom, you can throw in your email and download the free guide. Uh, you can find The Kink Consultant Podcast anywhere you get your podcasts. You can follow me on Instagram at the_kinkconsultant. And then finally, if you wanna meet me in Jamaica, I've got a special discount code for everyone. So you can go to swingcation.com and use TKC50, that's TKC for The Kink Consultant, 50, and get, I think it's up to $400 off depending on what package you go with. Wow. So check that out- Wow … 'cause I would love to see all of my, swinger kinksters, my swinky people there, and I'd love to, get you on the spanking train and teach you how to do some erotic spanking and dip your toes in the water of- We didn't- … kink … we didn't get to that yet, but yes.

56:50 Oh. Yes. That's gonna be so cool. That, that's frigging awesome. All of that information's actually gonna be in our show notes as well. Yes. So we're gonna have all of that, uh, on our show notes and in our blog. Yeah. That's right. Yeah. Uh, so Amanda, you're frigging awesome. Thank you for coming, all right, everyone. Well, that's a wrap on today's episode. If you enjoyed this one, do us a huge favor, like it, subscribe, follow the show, share it with a friend who needs to hear it, and if you've got 30 seconds, leave us a, a, a really good review, 'cause, you know- you like us, obviously- Yes … you're listening to the show. Just hit the five stars. And make sure you head to our website, www.beyond-monogamy.com. That's where you're gonna find everything, the listener confessional we mentioned, our full episode library, upcoming events, all of that.

57:35 It's on your one-stop shop that this man has created. That's right. And speaking of upcoming events, we'll be at, well, as of lately, this is the one that we're gonna be at for sure. Yes. We'll be at Crazy Winter Nights in Kansas City February 19th through the 21st of 2027. Uh, head to crazykazbah.com to grab your tickets. You can find that on the show notes, and use our code BEOMONO at checkout for a discount. Yes. You can also catch us live on streaming radio. We're on Full Swap Radio every Thursday at 2:00 PM and 7:00 PM Central, so head to fullswapradio.com to tune in. That's right. And here's something brand new. In just a few weeks we're launching our own live show, Thursday evenings, 7:00 to 8:00 PM Central Time.

58:19 That's right, on our own platform. You'll be able to find it through beyond-monogamy.com. You'll be able to pull it up, sit down, join us in a nice live conversation with me and Pris, plus all the other listeners hanging out in the room. Oh. No pressure, no big production, just a fun chat with real-time interaction. Yeah. So follow our socials so you don't miss the launch. We'll be announcing start dates very soon. Yes. And with that, we thank you all for joining us for another episode, and we will see you guys next week. Bye.